America's Anchors

You know, actually, I have a genuine admiration for O'Reilly's ability to do his show. I'd love to be able to put a chain of words together the way he does [snaps his fingers] without much thought as to what it might mean, compared to what you said about the same subject the night before.

STEWART: The other night -- this I loved -- O'Reilly said, "Here's why Kim Jong Il did the nuke test: He's trying to influence the American elections, the same reason Iran is ratcheting up." And I just imagine Kim Jong Il, in all his craziness, going, "Claire McCaskill's down by three points to Jim Talent. Launch the nukes! " O'Reilly's problem is not his ability to form rational arguments, because he's a very smart guy. It's his ego.

COLBERT: When he had Geraldo on, talking about Mel Gibson, they talked about Gibson for maybe thirty seconds. And then they go, "If you're rich and you're famous, everybody guns for you." And Geraldo's like, "Guys like us." And O'Reilly's like, "Exactly.'' And the next five minutes was just about them. I saw O'Reilly do an interview with President Bush, and he said, "Guys like us," and I said, "Shit, the most powerful man in the world and a guy with 2 million people a night watching his show." I keep that equation in the forefront of my character.

STEWART: The cornerstone of politics these days is grievance. It's really hard to keep that going when you're in power. I've admired their ability to hold on to that idea of being aggrieved while maintaining almost absolute control of all functions of government. I love it. And what are they most angry about? People who play the victim card.

COLBERT: Like Dennis Hastert saying, "I take full responsibility," and then, "I have done nothing wrong."

Stephen, you recently told "New York" magazine how much you liked Richard Nixon. Were you being sincere?

COLBERT: I have tender feelings for Nixon, because everybody has warm feelings about their childhood. Actually, I didn't like the Watergate trials 'cause they interrupted The Munsters.

STEWART: And Dark Shadows.

COLBERT [pointing to a Nixon poster above his desk]: Nixon was the last liberal president. He supported women's rights, the environment, ending the draft, youth involvement, and now he's the boogeyman? Kerry couldn't even run on that today.

Jon, you say you don't think Bush is stupid, but you think he talks down to people?

STEWART: The most emblematic characteristic that I think he possesses is competitiveness. If you read Karen Hughes' book, she talks about a note he wrote about the governor's race: "Fight fiercely. Yours in victory." That's what those guys are about: The operative principle is winning. But I don't think he is in any way remotely unintelligent.

COLBERT: I think the way you said it the other day on your show was "Bush is not dumb. He speaks to us like we're dumb."

But just before he ran for president, he was still trying to figure out why North Korea and other hot spots were important.

STEWART: That's being uncurious about the world, and self-involved. But that has nothing to do with intelligence. It just would surprise you that someone who wants to lead the free world would not necessarily know what that free world consisted of. And had only been to Epcot Center. It was sort of like his trip to Baghdad. He went for four hours into the Green Zone and comes back and says Iraq is making great progress. It would be like if we went to the Olive Garden and started going, "I understand Italy."

Stephen, I talked to you right after you did the famous White House Correspondents Dinner speech, and you seemed like you were in a state of shock. A friend of mine complimented you for being subversive, and you said, "I didn't want to be subversive. I just wanted to be funny."

COLBERT: I did not have a sense, as one critic said, that I was throwing a Molotov cocktail. One of my writers, Tom Purcell, said this very funny thing: "You threw a bottle of grape soda that happened to have a lit rag in the neck, and the room was soaked with gasoline."

For the first five minutes or so of the speech, President Bush looked like he thought you were defending him, but then he started to look irritated. Do you think he understood the irony?

COLBERT: We had a very nice conversation beforehand about that subject, actually. I said how nice it is that I, who am satirical and whose comedy can be critical of the administration, get to do this.

Did he talk to you after?

COLBERT: He said, "Well done."

STEWART: As in, how he would like to cook Stephen's hide on the barbecue.