Jed Clampett

Is this the economic equivalent of destroying the regulatory and enforcement infrastructure of a country, making protecting it and reducing the influence of extremists an impossibility, thereby making the US a much more threatened nation, and then giving the guy the medal of freedom?

That’s why I believe the government should have bought the foreclosed property rather than just giving money to the financial companies. At least the government would have had (using the national average) about 1,500 foreclosed houses to house 1,500 homeless families.

Jed Clampett

While the ‘culture warriors’ are helping their party destroy the Nation, others are finally coming to the realization that I’ve been trying to impress upon you for over a year. This is an ‘economic war’ as Warren Buffet describes it.
The two sides are the workers and the elites; not even the mere 3% making more than a quarter million a year, or the 1% making more than half a million a year, it’s the fewer than 1% making millions and millions per year.
While it may be easy for the sith to distract the public by blaming the economic collapse on people buying homes, it is easier for those of us paying attention that the value vacuum was implemented by the uber-wealthy, the over leveraged and uninformed.

Until we start seeing some of these guys at the very top on perp walks and sitting in prison awaiting trial rather than in a posh mansion, we will not get activity necessary in the markets. Once they start realizing they are not untouchable, they will begin to open up the ‘trickle down’ economy they have created for themselves.
This collapse cannot be blamed on the housing bubble even though it was the catalyst, it can be placed directly in the laps of banks, credit rating houses, investment brokers and the government of the previous decade; those that implemented their visions and solutions to the problem they see government as being, and brought us to this position we find ourselves in. Those that conspired to make themselves super rich on imagined value and the public’s retirement savings.
It’s good to see that GregD is now promoting the solution I proposed at the start of this collapse, it’s better than the ‘less taxes’ mantra that has been coming from the right side of the house.
It’s sad to see that Pres Obama is falling for the advice of his ‘experts’ and letting the government take responsibility for poorly written contracts and CDSs. It absolves the leadership of these institutions from any real accountability and that is the uderlying problem.

Savings and loans collapse.
Hedge fund collapse
internet bubble collapse
junk bonds collapse
airline industry collapse

At some point we must realize these collapses are intentional and expected in order to allow the few to increase their wealth out of the chaos heaped on the many.

Tim….the company will NEVER fail. China has over $1.5 trillion US dollars jus sitting in their bank and this company started in “China” back in 1919….so! you can put all the four letter words of the world on this page and it ain’t gonna change a thing. The fact tat your dollars are bailing the dipsticks out while China has D. C. and the American consumer by the ba!!s makes makes the whole world laugh tat much more. Until the American people put O” Glory first there gonna be a hard row to hoe. Have a gr8 week and please take a chill pill.

Jed Clampett

Since there are so many voices trying to get us to forget how we got to this economic position, perhaps a review of how we were lead here is in order.

Commodity Futures Modernization Act of 2000 introduced by republicans in congress removed regulations on Investment banks and Insurance corporations. Also in this beauty of a bill crafted by lobbyists for the financial industry, the loophole that allowed Enron to create an energy bubble that almost took down the economy.
In order to protect the credit card companies from those evil credit abusers, republicans introduced and passed the Bankruptcy Abuse Prevention and Consumer Protection Act in 2005, while imposing draconian rules on those going into bankruptcy over healthcare issues, the act also introduced some sweet loopholes and protections for the wealthy and businesses which today make them untouchable.
Then in 2006 the Credit Rating Reform act allowed the deregulation of Credit Ratings agencies which allowed issuers the luxury of shopping around for the best rating for their toxic assets.
There are more, I know, but this is all I have time for at the moment.
As you can see, this is not something that was unexpected and unforeseeable as the right wing wants to dissemble. It was in fact a concentrated, methodical, collaborative effort between the political party of those that wish to conserve wealth for themselves and the manipulators of wealth and power in Wall Street.
What you are seeing is a war waged on the public by the elite. As such, I am for giving the president the War Powers act in order to root out those who are involved in this conspiracy against the population by the ‘fortunate’ and ‘wealthy’ in positions of power.
I can’t remember the name of the act that stripped the rules that Fannie and Freddie had for issuing developmental mortgages and allowed the subprime lending craze to take hold, but I believe it was in the last year of Clinton or first year of Bush. Probably Bush because I remember him using the nation’s podium to promote the purchase of homes by all. Another indication of the conspiracy perpetrated on the American worker.

what a frightening thing to have happened…i feel like im in a horror movie, cheney is freddie c and bush is micheal!

Now do you see the light…..Tim

Jed Clampett

It didn’t just ‘happened’, it was a conspiracy by those who control the bulk of wealth aided by those unpatriotic enough to work against the benefit of the majority.

Jed, it’s nice to know days ahead…sometimes months and years…sad tat Tim never red..oops!
reads between the lines. very sad….. indeed.

Jed, along those ‘conspiracy’ lines, I do believe that the people in control of the wealth up to 2006, realized that progress and reform was on the way, and this was their way of slowing down progress. What kind of progress? Progress away from oil and derivatives. So, rather than get out of the derivative market, these financial institutions just decided to get deeper and deeper into debt, until finally, they were ‘too big to fail’. Being ‘too big to fail’ means that the government is going to have to spend trillions to save you, therefore impeding progress.

Think about progress in this country. It only happens when government spends, because they have the biggest piggy bank. Sure, the DJI grew to some pretty big numbers under conservative rule, but what progress did we make? Are our highways better? Are our planes better, air traffic control? Are our bridges better? How about public transportation? Are our dams working better? Are we any closer to being a ’solar nation’? How’s those electric cars coming along?

No, under Bush, the rich got richer and America suffered. Privatizing everything and deregulation leads to an infrastructure in shambles, which is exactly where we are. Shouldn’t WE be the nation with the best rail system? The best water system? The best health care system? The best communication system? The best media outlets? The best private transportation modules?

Yes, we should. But, no, we’re NOT.

Jed Clampett

The warning signs were there for all to see, the problem is we refuse to believe the signs because they lead to something so terrible. Sadly, this always leads to a self fulfilling prophesy because we ignore the problem until it is too big and untenable to handle in a controlled and appropriate manner.
There have been warnings of the screw up caused by ‘conservative’ policy on Wall Street at least since 2005 and even more pronounced and gathering steam since nov 2006, unfortunately, the mainstream media (tv, radio) only follow trends, the impending economic collapse just simply wasn’t trendy.

Right Jed. You’ve just hit the nail on the head. The ‘liberal media’ are the ones who let us know about the impending financial crisis. However, the ‘liberal media’ doesn’t have a huge platform in this country right now. They have about a 5% share of radio. TV and Print media are virtually the same.
So, the result is that the media would rather loop the audio of some senator crying ‘Soci@list’! Or, Commun!st!!

The ironic part is this: The consevative policies of derivative markets and exploitation of low-income ARM’s that put us in this place are being replaced by conservative echos of ‘Let them fail’.

Yes, people, I know Bill Clinton signed the deregulation bill. But, it was a republican bill and Clinton was in no position to use his Veto, if you recall. The ‘put the blame on Clinton’ bandwagon is the one that REALLY kills me. Shapeshifters, all.

Please, someone explain to me how you can be so totally against these corporate bailouts, leading to more frivolous business practices, yet still support Obama’s economic plan. Where exactly do the far left stand on capitalism, other than hating anything political policy they (you, I suppose) perceive any as remotely conservative?

Heaven forbid Bill Clinton’s name ever get mentioned with blame. I love how people take up for him like he did something for our country. He cut spending on defense and had fun in the oval office. His camp david accords are a joke now. Great Job, slick willie. Also, i forgot, NAFTA. Where have all the jobs gone????

Heaven forbid Bill Clinton’s name ever get mentioned with blame. I love how people take up for him like he did something for our country. He cut spending on defense and had fun in the oval office. His camp david accords are a joke now. Great Job, slick willie. Also, i forgot, NAFTA. Where have all the jobs gone????

The blame for the current financial crises goes back way before Clinton…most of the policies and ‘head in the sand’ style of regulation started in the Carter era. Clinton deserves some blame, but no moreso than any other factor in the collapse.

As for the bonuses, AIG is legally obligated to pay them. They have no choice; so renegotiate the contracts, or add the caveat that if you’re going to use taxpayer monies, then you’re subject to the govt telling you how to use them. If the UAW can renegotiate, then so can AIG. But its ludicrous to think that AIG, with everyone watching, is just going to do this because the TARP is a free handout.

Coach– The “liberal” media, if you want to call it that, overwhelming has control over the print and tv mediums. Radio is pretty conservative, whilst the Internet, the great equalizer, is split as many ways as possible. So bias is relative, depending on where you look…but can we finally kill this tired canard of the “liberal” or “conservative” media?

Vanhalen: I don’t remember 9/11 happening on Clinton’s watch. I don’t remember Bush ever balancing a budget. I don’t remember Bush leaving a surplus. I don’t remember Clinton invading, unilaterally, any sovereign nation. I don’t remember Clinton suspending habeus corpus. I don’t remember Clinton okaying illegal wiretapping. I don’t remember Clinton telling the country to ‘go shopping’ after 9/11. I don’t remember Clinton giving tax breaks to the ubermillionaires. I don’t remember Bush’s job growth being even remotely close to Clinton’s.

Sure, Clinton got his helmet rubbed out. But, really, who cares? What if everybody here made a big deal about your sex life?

History will show that the Republickers tried to impeach Clinton about his sex life, but have no problem looking the other way when their own do it: Vitter, Craig, Haggard, etc, etc, etc.

CCo

“Lenin and Stalin would love this stuff,” says Mike Huckabee. We are witnessing the Obama-era phenomenon of “European soci@lism transplanted to Washington,” says Newt Gingrich about Obamas’ type of capit@lism.

Conservatives attacked Franklin Delano Roosevelt as a soci@list as they are now attacking Barack Obama, when in fact Obama, like Roosevelt, is engaged not in creating soci@lism but in rebooting a crashed capit@list system. The spending in Obama’s stimulus plan isn’t a soci@list takeover. It’s the only way to inject money into a system in which private-sector investment, consumption and exports are locked down.

When Obama realizes his agenda what will emerge is a more soci@l, sustainable, competitive capit@lism. His more intellectually honest conservative critics don’t accuse him of Leninism but of making our form of capitalism more like Europe’s. Laissez-faire American capitalism is about to be supplanted not by soci@lism but by a more regulated, viable capitalism. Obama means to humanize capitalism through the instruments of democratic government.

Obameter– Roosevelt had the benefit of proposing something that had never been done before, and before large scale govt intervention was feared or skeptically looked at on a large scale. In retrospect, Roosevelts policies didnt solve the Great Depression, but the man deserves credit for trying his best in the face of unprecedented hardship.

Obama, on the other hand, has neither luxury. Obama, plain and simple, is a Western Europe styled Soci@list…whether or not the European model will work or not is a matter of debate, and his plan is not the only way. The European model works there because they have the European Union, and all the advantages that come with it. We dont…so, we’ll see if W. Euro Soci@l-Democrat Govt can work here.

Instead of wratcheting up spending, Obama should be cutting it. Nix unnecessary bureaucracy and money drains (hello Homeland Security and the War on Drugs). Reform wasteful spending that has marked the last 8 years, dont increase it. He should be slashing taxes across the board, espescially business taxes, which is about the only way to lure businesses away from cheap labor in the global south, along the lines of the Ireland model. Massively increasing spending in the face of a liquidity crisis is foolish. Espescially since we dont have the money to p.ay for it…I guess Obama has no problem just printing it.

Our capit@lism is just fine, so long as we remember that regulation, in moderation, is healthy. But the government would do best just staying out of the way and regulating where necessary, instead of expanding its reach into areas it should necessarily go.

With interest rates as low as they can go there’s a chance that tax cuts could even deepen the recession. Unfortunately, historically there’s never been an episode when we’ve tried reducing taxes with interest rates so low so we only have economic theory to guide us. Theory says it’s safer to stick to a spending based stimulus plan.

Merk,

It’s ‘common knowledge’ that WWII ‘ended’ the depression. But it is wrong to say FDR’s policies didn’t work.

FDR was elected under the banner of bringing change to the table (sound familiar) and the willingness to ‘do something,’ not just sit back and let the market ‘adjust’ itself. When people are going hungry and a generation is losing belief in itself, it’s a little hard to sit back and wait. (Not that you were expounding that proposition; I just had to toss that out.)

Things were so bad that the Capitalists were begging him for help and he responded with a number of programs revolutionary in nature.

And guess what, the economy began to turn for the better. But when that happened, the Capitalists turned for the worst and began fighting him at every step.

Sadly, the Supreme Court ruled a number of the programs unconstitutional. Now, who do you think brought those cases before the courts? Certainly not the working man looking for a job.

Getting those programs over-ruled is akin to jailing Al Capone for tax evasion. The Capitalists couldn’t find any other way to defeat FDR.

It is difficult to say if the programs were working or if the country was responding to the enthusiasm and confidence displayed by FDR. But things WERE improving before those greedy SOBs turned on him. With the onset of WWII, the issue becomes moot.

Irrespective, it is WRONG to say they didn’t work.

DD

Did you ever notice how it has been ingrained in many people’s minds that without World War II the Depression would have never ended. Does that mean that the $350 billion spent for the war, which was 5.5 times the total spent by the New Deal in 7-8 years, was the amount that should have been allocated by the government for the recovery? Somehow the right-wing wants it both ways. On one hand they decry the spending and the effort of the New Deal, and on the other hand they feel that we needed greater spending.

Dennis– Good post, I totally didnt mean to impugn on Roosevelt in any way, as not all aspects of the New Deal were bad or that they didnt work, just that the program as a whole was disjointed, for the reasons you explained, and other topical reasons as well. I have a softspot for Roosevelt, as I dont think any other president would have acted differently…I do think, however, that some have made more out of Roosevelts supposed big business tendency’s than is actually there…espescially on the right, where they confuse his actions with expansions carried out under LBJ’s Great Society…theres no indication, other than Soci@l Security, that Roosevelt even considered his programs to be anything more than a temporary setup to right the country economically.

Obameter– It wasnt what was spent, it was the manpower and the mobilization. Only men actively sought employment during the depression, whilst everyone (men, women, young, old) was committed into the war effort. This is why the fascist states were out of the Great Depression about 6 years beore we were; they totally mobilized their populations into producing for the state. So, if Obama had the chutzpah to demand total citizen mobilization to save the economy, I’d be singing a different tune about his economic policy (though preferrably not through the fascist model–by force).

Merk,

A soft spot for FDR. Careful, the Libertarian Police will be checking your credentials.

As a Liberal, I’m required by custom to revere the old bird and confess, for the most part, that I do. He could be a complete jerk to family and friends, and often was. He abandoned Missy, his personal secretary, when she got sick and often played one friend against another, telling each he was on their side. His role in choosing Truman as his running mate is confusing and disconcerting.

That said, one (me?) has to admire his courage, personality and political savvy. It is reported that he understood the mood of the people better than any Prez and his repeated elections would seem to bear out that claim. Certainly in modern times. It is premature to even suggest that young Obama is on or even choosing a similar course. But he could do worse than FDR as an example.

Obi,

It is sadly ‘common’ that philosophical arguers often resort to expanding semi-truths into Gospel. Both sides do it. The Right bestows ‘Lordliness’ upon their shibboleths whilst the Left bestows ‘Saintliness.’ It can be both comical and depressing at the same time. No wonder this country consumes Prozac, et al, like candy.

Just paying 3.5 times the amount wouldn’t have helped. First there would have been 40 million workers around the world that would still be alive and looking for work and eventually all those short term projects would have been finished.

There wouldn’t have been any major projects such as rebuilding cities destroyed by the war. There also wouldn’t have been many scientific discoveries from duct tape to computers, to atomic energy (the cost of turning theory into practicality about atomic energy at the time would have been labled prohibited) to the jet engine.

To me, it is very annoying to hear that FDRs’ New Deal wasn’t instrumental in ending the depression. However, it is extremely disturbing to hear that WW2 was somehow necessary for ending the depression. Your position is unconscionable, sir.

Jed Clampett

It’s fantasy, FDR had everything to do with the recovery. The oligarchy hated him for it and even attempted to have a coup against him, the general that was supposed to lead it actually turned them in.
In the end, they still got him, probably through his doctor. Just look at how quickly his health declined after the Tehran Conference and you might realize it’s not natural, even with his polio as backdrop.

The big money wanted to keep us out of the war, they wanted Hitler to take as much of Europe as possible, as they were heavily invested in his adventure. GrandPappy bush being one of the main investors, along with Ford, Disney, Lindbergh, etc. etc.

The conservative leadership want us to believe war is the only thing that will pull us out of this depression because War has been their intention from the beginning. The economic collapse may be just the thing to pull China into a global conflagration.