(Merkwurdigliebe)

Let the people of Florida vote on it…if they want the platforms, fine, if they dont, so be it…the economic benefits are worth considering (Similar drilling in the Netherlands and off of Cuba are turning out to be an economic goldmine)

that said, producing more oil of our own is only going to help with the speculation part of the equation, and price factors into many more areas…until we up our refining capacity (why is no one talking about this? We wouldnt need ANWR, or drilling off of Florida, if we simply increase our refining capacity) we can drill all the oil we want, but it isnt going to get to the pump any faster at current refining capacity

It’s my belief that the domestic drilling talking point has turned into a wedge issue for the GOP. Do we really think the GOP, with so many huge ties to big oil, want a domestic oil flow? With the amount of profits they’re making now, it would be a step backward for them to drill here. They know, as well as most of us, that getting that newly drilled oil online would take a long time. And, it would have very minimal effects on price for a long time.

They also know that the drilling legislation won’t pass, as it hasn’t for 30+ years. So, they can use it to paint the liberals as the stubborn ones that don’t care about saving people money.

You want to save money at the pump: Mandate government officials to drive electric cars. Yes, the feds, and state/local police. They’re as fast as anything around, so why not let the cops use ‘em? That mandate would lead to the construction of production plants, which would create mass production, and therefore an affordable car.

Don’t believe the hype about drilling. It’s become a wedge issue. Isn’t it time to realize that we need to go a different direction than adding more oil? Let us not forget oil’s sinister ways: environment, economic, and foreign policy influences……

Jed clampett

how fast do you think oil and gasoline prices would fall if tomorrow someone was to announce and prove a chevy avalanche that gets 70 MPG on regular unleaded ethanol blend?
VERY.
Because the only thing that will reduce the price of oil and subsequently gasoline is if less is consumed, in other words, get at least 80% of the energy in gasoline instead of 15. Drilling will do nothing except feed an addiction. It’s the equivalent of letting the Afghan farmers grow heroin. Not only does it eventually make our children addicted to a dangerous drug, it also fills the coffers of our enemies.
But gliebe likes that, it leads to constant war and will allow him to try and prove himself in the battlefield.

Hejus Jed, he never said any such thing. Quit putting words into other people’s mouth. You got a hard-on for Merk, fine, but quit creating issues.

Who exactly is drilling for oil “off of Cuba” ?

Jed Clampett

It’s good to see some intelligent people capable of funding have also followed up on crazy, impossible ideas that the gliebe doesn’t think have any viability.

http://www.oregonlive.c om/environment/index.ssf/2008/ 06/clackamas_engineers_inventi on.html

It’s that the big car companies aren’t doing it because they love easy money and research scares them. They are businesemen. Not engineers. That’s why they hoard money.
Tax incentives on new technologies focused on efficiency and changing the paradigm to electric motors powered by different sources of electricity are the most important and effective solutions long term. The Chinese and Indians may not want to get off oil anytime soon. But I would want to be there to offer them the technology to end their dependance on oil at an exhorbitant yet irresistible price. Wouldn’t you?

(Merkwurdigliebe)

Jed– you conveniently left out “not viable…at this time” which is true. I’ve never said anything against such technologies, just that it would take time to implement them properly over a wide portiong of the general american public, and if you werent so blatantly partisan you’d see that I advocate going to said technologies, albeit via a gradual process so as to give the economy time to adjust and to give the average consumer time to wean themselves off of oil

anonymous– I seem to have misspoke a bit: the Chinese have entered into contracts with the Cubans, but researching on the web has led me to believe that they haven’t physically started to drill…yet. Who knows what they’re waiting for, but they obviously believe that theres something down there…perhaps they’re waiting to see what our move in the region is, as this is our turf, internationally speaking

Jed Clampett

The consumer will consume whatever is presented for them to consume. They need no time to wean themselves off of oil because it is not them that has the addiction, it is a myopic leadership and industry that are the addicts and exhibit the classic signs of addiction, including denial. The power of government incentives and disincentives go a long way to changing paradigms. It forced out electricity as the prime mover and installed oil as our main power source merely because conressmen became heavily invested in te stuff. They were given a gift they would not refuse and helped destroy their world in the process.

If the television showed intelligent programs instead of crime shows and dramas, we would have less crime and drama. When the media tell you that only the bad stuff $ells. They are actually creating the demand for their own product by making it the only thing available… or something similar. Television tends to become homogeneous because when one finds a formula that becomes popular, the others try to copy it. Very little originality.

I find it interesting that you try to define and reduce all speakers as either left or right, you call me a partisan though you know I have no love for greedy morons on either side of the aile. By now you should know that, but choose to ignore it in order to continue to spread a propaganda. Did you think It would be difficult to sniff that out?

Ignorant liberals.

Merk, “just that it would take time to implement them properly over a wide portiong of the general american public, and if you werent so blatantly partisan you’d see that I advocate going to said technologies, albeit via a gradual process so as to give the economy time to adjust and to give the average consumer time to wean themselves off of oil”

Why is it you think we need anything more than an available electric car? Why is it you think so many other geopolitical things need to happen?

The cars are technologically feasible right now. Speed/safety/and reliability. The only thing that needs to happen is for the price to make them affordable. That’s it. As soon as someone b_uys an electric car, they’re off oil. Why do you continue to hide behind the fraudulent legend that it will ‘take forever’, without getting into the actual reasons it will take forever (republicans).

150+ miles on a charge.

Charge in 10 minutes with an adaptor.

95+ mph.

What else do you need?

Jed Clampett

30% increase in fuel mileage in a ford f-150 is nothing to sneeze at in my book.
Not sure where you got the ‘not viable… at this time’ quote, since the story i posted doesn’t even have the word viable in it. Is that just another attempt at misleading the readers?

“Driving up Interstate 5, Reid’s acquaintance got up to 90 percent increases in gas mileage. He could get 50 percent increases without noticeable performance drops.”

Seems their only trouble was increased production of NOX, but that has been resolved with decreasing the amount of oxygen used at combustion. Then again, you probably didn’t bother to read the entire story, since it goes against your needs.
Interestingly enough, there have been pattents of similar devices since the 1940’s, yet the car companies haven’t picked up on this until now… even so, they stall. I guess if I had alot of stock in exxon and other oil companies I would use my product to protect them as well… If I thought it was worthwhile to risk my freedom to collude with others to get richer at the expense of the planet.

Ignorant liberals, indeed. This Dickinson fellow makes me want to cancel my subscription to Rolling Stone because I’m not sure if the rest of the staff can be unbiased in their reporting. Guess Tim doesn’t realize that about $60 of the cost of a barrel of oil is just because of the fear that it might become scarce. Guess he doesn’t realize that the price will be reduced dramatically. Hell, in the Rocky Mountains alone we have three times the amount of oil that the Saudi’s have.

So you have two choices, drill in and around America or SHUT THE HELL UP ABOUT PAYING OVER FOUR DOLLARS A GALLON! Quite simple.

Dee-dee-dee!

Todd Hardy, do your homework my friend. The Department of Energy, itself, says it will take 7-10 years to get new domestic oil online and will lower the price of gas about 10 cents.

Unless our domestic oil is nationalized, it will be traded with the rest of the oil on the commodities market. It’s the speculators that have driven the price up. The good, old, Enron loophole. Analysts claim up to a 50% decrease in price at the pump if the loophole is closed.

Drilling off the coasts will not happen. And, it’s not the answer. Forward thinking people. Please.

Incorrect! I’ll find the NEW stats, just released yesterday. AT MOST, in deep water, 5 years but realistically, 2-3 years. I’ve done my homework.

On a side note, Clinton said 10 years about… wait for it… 10 YEARS AGO! We wouldn’t be paying $4 now if he’d have done it then. Do you want to wait for it to reach $9 then start???

Be back with your updated info…

there will be no more refineries built…period.

drilling offshore in no quicker than 5 years will not bring down the price of gas.

we need to blame speculation and a system of laws that encourage it’s missuse.

(Merkwurdigliebe)

Coach- two things: 1)the switch from oil is going to take time because EVERY vehicle is going to have to come off oil, and that is going to take time. As Dennis pointed out earlier, what do you propose to do about semis, planes, large boats, tractors, combines, earthmovers, lawnmowers, or anything that runs on oil? (of which there are many more things) All of that is going to take time to replace. What about the military, who account for a large chunk of our oil use? Are they going to switch as well? If so, what is the time frame, and what will it cost? Also, electric cars are great for someone who is well connected to a grid, but it isnt going to work well for Joe-Schmo in South Dakota or Wyoming who lives in the boonies with a minimal grid. Also, do you have figures that would show if our current power grid would hold up if every driver suddenly switched to driving an electric car?

2) Do you have a plan to deal with all the job loss that will accompany an immediate shift off of oil? Millions of people depend on “evil” oil companies to provide them a living, and many states depend on it as a source of revenue, particularly Alaskans, Texans, and Louisianans…a gradual change would prevent a massive job loss by allowing transition, which, let me assure you, would be felt by the economy…so if you have a plan to deal with this in your abrupt shift, please illuminate on it…also, the government, on both sides, is going to be reluctant to do away with the oil companies, as they account for a large chunk of the money the govt recieves from tax revenues (second only to the income tax), and methinks your going to have to pry that money teat from their cold, dead fingers

so, this isnt oil company propaganda, but the REALITY of the current situation…these are realistic questions that have to be addressed in the upcoming switch, and you have yet to fully address them

Celtic– perhaps if we had built more refineries, we wouldnt be in this predicament…hmm, increased demand, stable refining capacity since about 77, recipe for disaster much?

ehem… increase efficiency of gasolines from the current 15% to 80% and the reduction in demand will be almost instantaneous.

far from the grid… hey kid, got solutions or do you only know how to whine?

republicans want to paint the issue as a supply problem. if it is seen as such then we would all rally behind a domestic exploration / drilling push. this would be great for our oil majors – good business for them. same old story… but it won’t make a dent in world supply, it won’t help our pocketbooks. they want to squeeze every last drop; prices will increase until the political price is too unbearable. $4.00/gallon is here to stay folks.

ask yourself – why would refiners like valero, marathon or sunoco want to build more refineries and thus take a chance at bringing down the price of gas – hurting their earnings? refineries are a bottleneck for this very reason.

IT’S PASS THE BUCK -
bush blames saudis, saudis blame speculators, speculators blame refiners, and they ALL get rich while maintaining a status quo.

there are great opportunities for our domestic automakers if they would only show some leadership and shift us from this losing paradigm.

Merk: By your rationale, I guess we shouldn’t change the health care system, because it would put a lot of insurers out of ‘legitimate’ jobs…..

And, to answer your questions about planes, trains, etc…the whole time I’m talking about PERSONAL TRANSPORTATION. Planes and trains fall under ‘mass transportation’. Personal transportation would be quite simple. You don’t have to ‘pull all the current cars off the road’. Just offer us something else. That’s it. Once the masses realize that an affordable alternative is available, do you think they’ll continue to choose gas guzzlers? As soon as Big Oil stops colluding with government, and government actually gets on board, alternatives will become available. And, I’m talking about FUELLESS ALTERNATIVES.
As far a oil jobs lost: “So.” (Cheney 2008). Solar jobs, wind jobs, hydrogen jobs, battery production jobs. Or, with all that extra money in people’s pockets from not having to purchase gas, maybe the small business market will boom, rather than big industry enslaving us??

Sorry for the delay Coach; I had to fly to New York to do a corporate restructuring. Here is the info I promised:

Eric Bolling from Fox Business News confirmed with officers from Transocean and Diamond Offshore, each independent of knowing he had contacted the company, and they confirmed that by drilling in the outer continental shelf we could have oil within 2 years (86 billion barrels waiting) and if we drilled in really, really deep water, within 3-5 years.

Also, the Brazilians, in the last 2 years, have increased their offshore reserves from 10 billion barrels to 90 billion barrels. They’re now projected to be totally independent of the Middle East.

So now, please bash me with some left-wing falsehoods as to why this isn’t true. That’s what the left seems to be really good at.

…waiting

PS- Does anyone remember why the United States purchased Alaska? FOR ITS RESOURCES!!! Not because it was pretty, because we wanted to USE THE LAND! That was the sole purpose. Alaska is a tool and we should use it as such.

And for the record, I have a home in Satellite Beach, FL; I can walk to the beach in 5 minutes. Bring the oil rigs!