This makes sense when almost all the major news institutions are beating the war drum right along with the Administration and Israel. They’ve got the money the president has already given authorization as force after they listed the Iranian army as a terrorist organization. Now they’re fitting stealth bombers with brackets that will be able to hold these new humungous “bunker-buster” bombs. It’s already in motion and nobody really cares why or that it’s being done in their name with their money. We will have yet another enemy for the next 50 years. Wow, this is depressing.

Sorry. I wrote that while I was working. Second sentance should read: They’ve already got the money to do it and the president has already given authorization to use military force after listing the Iranian army as a terrorist organization.

Yes we are Tim…yes we are

Is it time to start floating theories about this being yet another element in the grand design that will culminate in the Presidential election being indefinitely suspended in the interest of “homeland security?”

With this current administration they just might prove that 2 wrongs do make a right!

Maybe they can hold a “fake” war taking after FEMA’s example. That all starts from the Top!

It certainly is a result of something, but not what you mock.

Google “confessions of an economic hitman” to see a slightly bigger picture of our foreign policy from the personal account of one man who was intimately involved in bringing us to where we are today.

Stanley Kubrick would make the best movie about this possible.

The human race really is programmed to destroy itself isn’t it?

yea, they could use the angle of Extra Terrestrials manipulating well positioned leaders into taking us to self destruction by making them think they are helping God by bringing on armageddon.
Any better explanations why humans are intent on destroying their planet and themselves while destroying their history and culture at the same time?

Is this the same 52% that allegedly voted this comedy act into Washington DC?

Strange: It’s a poll by an organization no one has ever heard of, reported in a website no one has ever heard of. Is this what Karl Rove is doing these days??? LOL!!

Jed-
The answer to your question is entropy. Conciousness is the only antidote.

This poll shows a majority of Americans understand this threat and what it could mean.

entropy is a modern construct, made up by modern man to explain away the fact that his new methods are totally contrary to the workings of nature.
Nature always works towards ectropy.
Something has happened in humanity’s recent history, say the last 5000 years or so, to change that. Why? To what aim have we changed from the philosophy of life to one of death? In our recent past, as evidenced by the precolumbian inhabitants of the americas, we understood the need for development, growth, stability, sfficiency and an increasing order that led to a supereconomy. It was the arrival of the europeans and the spread of their disease/s that brought decay, instability, deterioration, inefficiency and the bankruptcy and subsequent economic collapse, entropy if you will, that destroyed not only their way of life but their culture and knowledge as well.
You see, before the european phenomenon, people understood the need for cooperation rather than senseless competition. In those days succeding together was valued much more than today’s win at all cost and all else be damned mentality.
Ectropy is what we should be working towards, rather than succumbing to entropy merely because we refuse to see what is right in front of us and make the revolutionary choices that will propel us forward.

Jed-
Respectfully, I must disagree with your last remarks regarding entropy. Entropy is not a made up concept, at least in the thermodynamic sense of the word. The concept of entropy is an essential concept that emerges from the Laws of Thermodynamics, which are validated over and over again experimentally and in derivative technologies in common use. I referenced entropy because I truly believe that it is the root of all suffering. Biological processes, particularly consciousness, seem to be the only artifacts of this Universe capable of resisting entropy. Personally, I think that anywhere you find suffering, you are bound to discover that something has fallen apart. Taken to its extreme, I think that this tendency can be traced back to the thermodynamic processes underpinning physical reality. If human beings can escape the implications of entropy, it will be because consciousness is truly greater than the sum of its parts. Call this greater sum spirit or soul, or just leave it as consciousness, but it is the only that gives me faith that the Universe is destined for more than a brief effervescence, followed by an eternity of cold darkness.

Bomb Iran??
Why not,, I don’t think we’ve bombed them yet,, have we??
And lest we forget,, “Mr. Mock Mood I’m a Dimmer Job,”, has been kind of asking for someone to bomb his little turd of a country..

Look on the bright side,, or the less bright side,, pending on how you look at it..
If we bomb iran, we’re going to use conventional bombs,, what bet Israel wont be using ” conventional bombs”,, AND COME ON, IF WE DON’T BOMB IRAN,, ISRAEL IS GOING TO GIVE THEM NUCLEAR WEAPONS,, JUST NOT THE WAY THAT THE IRANIAN LEADERSHIP WANTED,, KIND OF LIKE THE WAY WE GAVE JAPAN NUCLEAR BOMBS,,
Well anyhow,,
iran will not be the same iran that we know today,, in a few years, we’re going to see a whole new iran,, what that will be,, don’t know yet,, the AMERICAN people have not made up their minds about that yet

Americans will bomb anybody, provided it will not cause gas prices to rise or put a dent in the 401k. That’s a fact.

that’s a wonderful, wordy and perhaps somewhat skewed way of looking at thermodynamic entropy. someone else may have simply described it as decay.
It is a human construct just as anything else we have constructed to express what we perceive. Whether that perception is wrong or not is another matter. The ‘thermodynamic laws’ that you refer to are not so much laws as they are observations, incomplete observations at that, they tend to look at the effects and view them as cause. The second law is particularly difficult since it seems that every natural system disproves it. That’s for a different discussion though.

” I think that anywhere you find suffering, you are bound to discover that something has fallen apart.”
Are you going for some award for stating the obvious as if it was a newly discovered fact? Evidently something has been broken, otherwise we would not be going through this unnatural population explotion and resource destruction or these discussions for that matter.
Since you are so familiar with entropy, then perhaps you could explain ectropy. Since it was the prevalent natural condition until relatively recent history, one would think we would have used that part of the natural order of things to power our systems, unfortunately that part of Maxwell’s equations were done away with by heavyside.

Entropy is present in all systems, they have built in decay, for example falling hair or skin cells(it prevents things from living forever as well), but while living and growing, ectropy has the upper hand.
Once we start dying, entropy sets in and we start decaying. Theoretically, if we can enhance ectropy and limit entropy, we could live indefinately.
Ectropy is the natural order of things, we are working against the order of things. Even though we have realize this, those in power among us refuse to do the things to resolve the issue. Repeatedly they ignore our pleas to be conciensious stewards of the environment, they ignore our clammor for affordable healthcare, for sensible policies, for enforcement of established laws against corruption, yet we get no satisfactory response, merely rethoric and delaying tactics.
If this issue is the most important thing facing us today, yet we are diverted into focusing on killing others. why? because the plan is to force us into destroying ourselves, and when 5% of the people control 85% of the wealth, you only have to influence that 5% to have a devastating effect on the other 95%.

What do you mean by ectropy being the natural order until recently? Are you talking the miniscule time that humans have existed relative to the age of the Earth, the Big Bang? Does this have anything to do with aliens from beyond? Are you really a clam among mollusks? Do you have a ponytail? Do you braid it?

Ole,

Are you okay? That was really, really weak.

Perhaps it would help if you didn’t try to force the issue. Let it flow. Let it come out naturally.

Ponytail?

is that your definition of ectropy?

What happened to all the erudition?
what’s the matter? ET got your tongue?
Did you suddenly get a mental block and all that comes out is the poison you’ve allowed yourself to be filled with?
Are you really trying to back out of answering the ectropy question because you don’t know about it or just deflecting the point again?

How else can one respond to nonsense? Responding to Jed’s pseudoscientific ramblings makes about as much sense arguing evolution with a creationist.

another tactic employed by them and warned about in ancient times.

when the theme becomes too complex for them to incorporate, they react violently, dismissing the topic outright and closing the issue as nonconsecuential or simply absurd. This is done over and over again by some of our political leaders. Sensenbrener comes to mind during the Terry Schiavo hearings.

It may be nonsense to you, who are hoping to deflect attention from the issue so that it doesn’t get seriously investigated, but there are many other’s who refuse to be blinded or have witnessed so many absurdities in our behaviour that they demand a thorough investigation of the issue. Not the dismisive ‘pseudoscience’ used to explain away events during project blue book.

BTW – If the creationist is an intelligent, open minded person, it’s no trouble and have done so many times.
In fact, we’ve come to the determination that they are not mutually exclusive, since we don’t suscribe to the arrogance of thinking we are capable of understanding what a day in the life of God is like or how long it would be to our senses.

Despite your eloquence in these posts, I suspect you would not be one of those able to debate the issue civilly regardless of the side of the issue you happen to espouse.
Your sense of supremacy would get in the way.

Jed-
What is this ancient text that you keep referencing, when you mention my ‘tactics’? The only tactics I have ever been aware of learning were taught to me at the USMC School of Infantry and I am don’t think I am applying them to my analysis of your ramblings.

hold on, let me get it for you since this Marine can’t seem to adapt and improvise enough to figure it out for himself… (what was it the 9/11 commission said was the reason al Qaeda was able to his us… lack of imagination I think it was.) one sec!…

BTW – did anyone catch the southpark trilogy on terrorism?

Jed-

Take a dump in one hand and imagine in the other. See which one gets fuller. Why don’t you try that out? We call that an experiment in the sciences. When we’ve actually carried out an experiment like the one described above, then we feel we’ve learned something about which we can begin to speak with increasing certainty. But it takes discipline to defecate in one’s hand. Sometimes it has to be done repeatedly. Do you think you’re up to the task? When you’re done, find a round room and piss in the corner. If you can’t find one, just use your imagination.

well, I’ve never had anyone ordering me to defecate on my hand over and over, so I can’t relate to your experience. Sorry to hear you had to endure that… you weren’t in the interrogation core, where you?
Never mind, prob just ‘first responder’ serving at the prez’s whim. Something of a private army if you will.

I can understand how you would not value imagination, sometimes folks ridicule those things they lack and envy others possessing it.

It was Einstein’s imagination that helped him visualize the atomic interactions that led to his theories. Seems to me that much of our engineering is based on bright imaginations. JC Maxwell was able to imagine and mathematically prove that saturn’s rings are made of different sized particles instead of a solid or gaseous material as was speculated at the time. His imagination served him quite well, unlike the FBI directors that couldn’t imagine that an arab taking flying lessons and not caring about taking off and landing was part of a terrorist team about to strike within the US.
So, although machines and their puppets could never begin to comprehend the value of imagination, to us humans, it is the thing that separates us from all the other earthlings and has allowed us to survive as long as we have.