From 3,107 to 1,500 words. Eh, it could still just be editing out grammar mistakes, right?

When a government censors damning evidence that industry does in fact have a significant negative impact on changing weather conditions, it makes me much more likely to pay attention to said censorship. There is a lot of hype and exploitation (see ethanol from the so called green alternative fuel nonsense) on both sides, but all this does is make me more skeptical of any government sponsored ‘evidence’.

Hey, they hide evidence of flying saucers and extra terrestrial encounters too, what do you think that means. Remember project blue book, it was designed to refute any reports of UFO sigtings. It’s somewhat telling that it’s director later turned out to have been convinced that the phenomenons are real and wrote a book to show his evidence.

Jed-

You watch way too much television.

Jed-

You watch way too much television. Do you really think Unsolved Mysteries has the scoop on extraterrestrials?

Mexico even has university courses in UFOlogy because after a solar eclipse they had so many sightings reports and video from the general public that it could no longer be denied.
Yet the rest of the world continues to operate from the mindset that they are a work of fiction, an overactive imagination.
So many among us have had experiences that even mainstream media outlets like ABC have devoted a couple of hours of primetime television on the subject. So, no, I don’t think that Unsolved Mysteries has a scoop on anything, they are merely reacting to the evidence and a desire from the public to know more about the subject. Unfortunately, most of what we get are dismissals and ridicule… come to think of it, that seems to be their tactic whenever a subject they don’t want exposed is broached.
Just look at how pigglet and the prop sniffer react to the issue of climate change. Their aim is not to explore or debate the issue, they seek to quash any serious discussion on the subject, they insult others intelligence, poke fun at them and then offer ridiculous rebuttals. These tactics are designed to quash the discussion and bury the topic, preferably under a cloud of ridicule and absurdity so that it is never seriously discussed again. Come to think about it, you seem to do the same thing on occassion.

Jed, there’s one thing you have to realize about those ‘other’ contributors to the forum that you mentioned (piglet, prop snorter, etc). That is this: That IS their argument. They think that they’ve won the argument once they point out that you’re being ‘liberal’. Remember, liberalism is a disease to most conservatives in this country, so once they see the ‘disease’ exposed, they pounce on it and try to make fun of it.
But, I agree about global climate change and them not having any kind of valid responses to it.
As far as this topic:
The world is flat, no it isn’t.
Wouldn’t we have to be the most arrogant mammal on the planet if we honestly believe that there ISN’T other life forms in outer space? We’ve NEVER recieved any evidence supporting the fact that we’re the only life form in the universe, but yet we’ll deny ufo sightings. Humans, particularly whites, are weird man! They’re the most paranoid people I’ve ever met in my life and I’m one of them……….
Those Indians are gonna get us!
Those blacks are gonna get us!
Those mexicans are gonna get us!
The russians are gonna get us!
The islamofascists are gonna get us!

Meanwhile, add up the total of deaths caused by Americans compared to those inflicted on Americans. Not even close my friend………..Hiroshima and Nagasaki made sure of that. Yet, here we go again. We’re the only country to ever use nukes and we’re scared somebody else is going to use them……….

Bender-
As horrific as the atomic-bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were, the death-toll (even after elevated cancer rates are taken into consideration) is tiny compared to the death-toll wrought by Europeans on one another during WWII, or Japan’s murderous occupation of Manchuria. If you would like a more contemporary example, look into the Second Congo War, which claimed far more human lives than the atomic-bombing of Japan. I am afraid that Americans are not the purveyors of death and destruction that you would like to characterize them as. I think that killing is something endemic to all of humanity and no matter what your self-loathing leads you to believe, your particular heritage is nothing special in its tendency towards bloodlust.

Well, sure, that is their tactic. To actually stiffle discussion on any subject they deem unworthy or threatening.

I mean, look at how our ‘friend’ here starts off by attacking and ridiculing us, as if the mere fact that the air force had to set up a program to refute the reports that were being brought up aren’t enough to conclude that something annomalous is truly going on.

Now look at the tactics employed by our government and to a lesser extent the antagonists here on these threads, you will notice they are the same tactics we have been warned about by ‘prophets’ of practically all the religions.

Like you say, they are arrogant enough to consider themselves the highest order of life in the universe, even higher than most other humans.
They cannot recognize the things of value in their own world. They fail to see how water is the most valuable thing in the universe and that our weakness and disunity are exactly what is needed for a theft of that resource to be successful.

As you can see, when faced with something they can’t refute or deny as the main topic of your discourse, they grab some inconsecuential point and expand it and agrandize it in order to obscure a complete field of view. Remember when they railroaded Howard Dean because of a screwed up yell?

Seems the invasion did start with the whites. They are the first ones to switch from a model of cooperation and merit to a model of subserviance and classism. However, these days, the affected are among all of us, within any group… think of it like an ‘invasion of the body snatchers’ in slow motion.
The invaders must be deliberate, patient and careful. If the invaded become aware and start doing what they were created to do, protect and support the planet, then their plans fall apart and the endeavour fails. Thousands of years to reap the spoils of an entire planet is nothing to such an old race of machines.

Blood: Nobody is debating what you are saying about the Europeans/Germans, etc….and the damage they inflicted on people throughout history. But, to nobody’s surprise, you spun the argument. My point was to make reference to the amount of deaths AMERICANS have inflicted versus the amount of deaths inflicted upon AMERICANS. Germans killing jews, and Europeans killing Germans, etc, etc, etc has absolutely nothing to do with the fundamental argument.
I guess what I’m saying is this: Take a look at how many people American military action has killed in our short existence…….

But, I shouldn’t have expected anything different from you Blood, than to say “As horrific as the atomic-bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were, the death-toll (even after elevated cancer rates are taken into consideration) is tiny compared to the death-toll wrought by Europeans on one another during WWII, or Japan’s murderous occupation of Manchuria.”

Europeans on one another, and Japan killing Manchurians. Where is the word ‘American’ in that statement?

But, I guess you’re one of those who puts America on top of the food chain and the globe’s ‘moral majority’. Good luck with that…….Iraq screwed that all up for ya, didn’t it?

And another thing: Cancer kills up to 3000 people a day. How much of our federal budget goes to cancer research on a yearly basis?

9/11 killed 3000 people and we’re going to put anywhere from 750 billion to a trillion, and counting, toward that ‘war’??? Where’s the balance here?

Hey Blood: Not to pile on, well, okay, maybe a little…….

Here’s your last post on the ‘what’s in your closet’ forum:
“One of the ways that this is most obvious occurs when people pile up historical facts to demonstrate nothing more than the false notion that their side is good and the other is bad.”

Now, read your earlier post on this forum trying to refute Bender’s statement about the difference in American killing vs. American deaths: “As horrific as the atomic-bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were, the death-toll (even after elevated cancer rates are taken into consideration) is tiny compared to the death-toll wrought by Europeans on one another during WWII, or Japan’s murderous occupation of Manchuria. If you would like a more contemporary example, look into the Second Congo War, which claimed far more human lives than the atomic-bombing of Japan.”

Now wouldn’t that contradict your assessment of one of your ‘pet peeves’???

another of those tactics we were warned about?

They tend to talk up a pretty piece when extolling their own virtues and accomplishments and almost in the same sentence they refute themselves. What’s even stranger, they are unnaware of their own hipocresy, it’s almost as if they are possessed by an alien entity or something.

No, because I wasn’t piling up historical evidence to support some idea of one side being good and another bad. I was pointing out that when one actually considers historical evidence, the distinction is not so clear distinct.

his point was that human beings, in general, are nasty, brutish little apes who delight in inflicting pain and suffering on one another

the americans arent the only evil in the world, if anything, we may not be perfect, but we’re a hell of a lot better than the alternative…we just need work, we’ll get there, eventually

Jed-
You are a clam among mollusks.

For some reason, you won’t acknowledge the distinctly unbalanced totals of Americans killed by foreigners vs. foreigners killed by Americans. Your point about OTHER historical wars is absolutely pointless. But, you’ll use it to further your own belief. EXACTLY what you said you hate…….

We might as well move on from this one……

That’s another fallacy that we are fed and consume with apparent gusto… “human beings, in general, are nasty, brutish little apes who delight in inflicting pain and suffering on one another.”

if that was truly the case we would have never built pyramids, aqueducts or stone highways. Humans are inherently kind, cooperative, caring and empathic. This is evidenced by the nature of our children, who demonstrate their inherent virtues over and over. It is environment that changes the human, but it has to be a constant negative environment, otherwise, the positive being reverts to positivity.

It does not surprise me that they would rather have us believe that humans are inherently evil and abuse of each other. That would allow them to justify their actions, it will allow them to say they are rescuing us from ourselves and have made a comfortable place in heaven for us.
You can see it over and over again in these posts. Since our little ‘friends’ are tied in to the same ‘alien collective conscience’ they seem to speak with one voice, all clammoring to stiffle the debate, feigning ignorance at things they themselves have stated at times. Could they be that forgetful or merely that deceitful?

Only an outside influence by an invisible alien force can explain the insanity humans have been engaged in for the last couple of millenia, unfortunately, we may have weakened our planet enough now to be easy pickings. Unless we start working to protect our home and our human resources we will find ourselves not only fighting each other, but the ‘common alien enemy’ president Reagan spoke of so many years ago.

Bender/Jed,

Good stuff. Enjoyable reading.

Coach,

I’ll bet you were a sign stealer, weren’t you? Always watching for some chink in the opponent’s armor.

You guys can play on my team anytime.

ah yes, the Pyramids, aqueducts and stone roads that the Egyptians and Romans used SLAVES to build…

i’m not saying that man doesnt have those capacities, but man’s fundamental nature has not changed…we’ve gone from a caveman being able to bludgeon another for whatever, to nuclear weapons that can wipe out millions at a time

the technology changes, yet mans basic animalistic desires still force their way through…whether or not this is all orchestrated by aliens is up to debate…i personally think that life has to exist somewhere out in the vast cosmos, but to say that there is some evil force behind everything is a bit weird…do you have any concrete evidence?

humm,let’s see!! You have trouble accepting an alien force is behind the self destruction and entropy we are experiencing, even though there is countless annecdotal as well as physical evidence that, albeit circumstancially, points in that direction. These accounts are even provided by a former president and a presidential candidate, yet to you these people are wackos who hallucinated something so outlandish and believe it so deeply that they were willing to put up with ridicule to expose it.
On the other hand you willingly imbibe and regurgitate the fantasy that Iran is working on making nuclear weapons even though the IAEA and national as well as foreign intelligence services have been unable to find evidence to that effect.
Buddy, your level of hypocresy rises to the level of priceless!!!

oh yes, the old “fantasy” about Iran, a regime that since 1979 has been virulently anti-west from the get-go, who is actively killing our soldiers, actively funding terror via Hezbollah, and you think Iran is just a bunch of missunderstood dudes trying to get electricity? I woldnt trust the mullahs as far as i could thrwo em…we already tried this with North Korea, we sat around and they “promised” the US, the UN and whomever else that they werent developing nuclear weapons, when, golly gee, they all of a sudden had one, and the UN did nothing

the difference? with North Korea you have a larger hegemon in the region to hold sway (China or Japan)…Iran, other than Saudi Arabia, IS the hegemon in the middle east, and please extrapolate how a nuclear armed Iran would be a good thing?

you can either watch the skies for aliens who may or may not appear/be real, or you can bury your head in the sand over Iran and their nuclear capabilities…i’m not calling for war, but there is no reason not to be tough with these guys, or to just look the other way while they develope nuclear technologies that they can pass on to a terrorist organization

oh, and just becasue someone puts themselves up to ridicule, doesnt mean their story is true…ever heard of pathological liars?

Merk,

“…Iran, a regime that since 1979 has been virulently anti-west from the get-go, who is actively killing our soldiers, actively funding terror via Hezbollah.”

And you know all this to be true, how? Killing our soldiers? You mean by providing military aid to the Shia in Iraq? How does that differ from the U.S. arming the Kurds? And which came first?

I’ve ‘heard’ all the same through the MSM. But I’ve also heard, not so much via MSM, that Iran has often been cooperative and even friendly with the U.S. It’s my understanding they ‘helped’ when we went after Al Qaeda.

We hear anti-American rhetoric all the time, but aside from allegations, I’m not so sure that Iran has actively undertaken any acts against the U.S. They’re for sure ‘involved’ in what’s happening in Iraq and why not? They have more of an interest in the outcome of the civil war than we do. Their peace of mind would be greatly enhanced if a Shia regime were to triumph in Baghdad.

And given that this country refuses to even talk to them and brands them as terrorists, don’t you think they have a reasonable cause to doubt this country’s good intentions vis a vis Iraq? If I was an Iranian, I’d see the U.S.’ Iraqi adventure as a cover to get a military presence right on my border.

Personally, I am pleased to see Putin chummying up with Iran. Keeps a balance going that may, just may, deter our lunatic imperialists from turning all of the Middle East into a war zone.

If the U.S. ‘strikes’ at Iran after NEVER having talked to them, aside from giving them orders, just what does that make us?

Just for grins, look at a map. With the U.S. ‘occupying’ Iraq, Iran is bordered by ‘us’ and Turkey, a potential ally against them, some former Soviet republics, Afghanistan and Pakistan. If hostilities SHOULD break out, who do you think the later two countries with side with? And who has a bomb? If this is all about stopping Iran from getting the bomb, then this has to be the STUPIDEST way imaginable to achieve that goal.

What’s this about aliens? When/how did that get introduced into the discussion? You can’t just drop that stuff into a conversation and expect people to nod their heads as if they will know what you are talking about.

read the second and third entries… oh yea, the reading comprehension thing.

thats a good point over whos arming who…like i said, i dont want to rush to war, or to go to war period, becuase i dont know where we would get the troops, unless we start shifting them out of Germany or South Korea or something

i do think that this can be handled diplomatically, or with sanctions, rather than bombs…but i want to keep a quasi-hardline stance with Iran…nothing about the mullahs and their actions over the years has lended itself to trustworthiness

and if war were to break out? i think that Pakistan and Afghanistan would remain neutral and play it safe…but i hope that the situation doesnt degrade into that

uh.It’s called a draft!!!

That’s when you are forced enlistment into the military to defend the motherland from a ragtag band of criminals funded by the sale of camels and led by a protege of the CIA.

shouldn’t there be a law that if a war has a protracted duration a draft should kick in automatically, picking up the sons and daughters of the political class as well as the aristocratic first, since we need the best of the best out there to accomplish the mission.

Jed-

I read your post. I just don’t know how you expect the rest of us to be follow along when you drop stuff like hidden UFO reports. I mean, unless you’re talking about the same silly tv shows we’ve all watched on the Disco. Channel while smoking doobies, I sure would like to hear about this scoop. For the rest of us who are not privy to the same flow of information that you enjoy, please elaborate (or at least fabricate something that will be good for a laugh or two).

so you can accept most of the fantasy and imaginative speculation about other humans’ intentions when they haven’t even bothered to understand said culture yet are grossly distressed by an equally wild suppossition about why humans are killing themselves and their planet?
If you ask me, there seems to be alot more evidence of extraterrestial intelligent life than ‘muslims hate our way of life’ type of statements. Haven’t heard you try to suppress their statements with as much fervor. Why?
What is it about the theory that bothers you so much?
Is it so much easier to believe that humans are inherently evil and predisposed to visit all kinds of attrocities and inequities on each other than it is to believe that we are being affected by an outside invader that for the last 5k years has been changing the human collective consciousness in order to weaken us and make us easy pickings for an invasion?

Funny you should mention pony tails though, perhaps you subconsciously know more than you allow yourself to realize.

Jed-

I saw a UFO once, no joke.

Ole,

I’ve had a friend relate a story of same hereabouts. His wife and children were witnesses as well.

Something IS going on. Sure hope something ‘reveals’ itself in my lifetime. I don’t want to check out with SO many unanswered questions.

any idea what the tales of the ‘rapture’ are about?

If you are referring to the last book of the Christian Bible, then I think that it is widely believed by biblical scholars that the text is metaphor or code used to promote an anti-Roman perspective to readers of the day who would have been familiar with images and symbols used by the author (John of Patmos). I think you would really dig D.H. Lawrence’s take on it titled Apocalypse, if you haven’t read it already.

that would be the appocalypse, I was asking about the rapture.