I just wish everyone would quit saying “General Betrayus”. it’s not original and you didn’t come up with it! I don’t know how many times I have heard that stupid phrase today.

Gen.Petraeus, gave the administration the lift it needed., he said what people wanted to hear its working, we can start getting out and pre surge levels next summer. sounds good General.

hmm, he didnt seem to sugarcoat anything…it will be interesting to see how the surge will go from here on out

in any case it wont mean rain in a bucket if the Iraqi govt doesnt get its stuff together

Ray: He said what people wanted to hear? OK, that’s it. I’m done commenting on your posts. You DO realize that over 70% of people in the United States are against the war in Iraq, don’t you? So, how did Petraeus say what we wanted to hear?????
Merk. He DEFINITELY sugar-coated things. The surge was designed to secure Baghdad for political reconciliation. But, Petraeus and his cronies are using Anbar Province as the talking point. He doesn’t even talk about Baghdad, per say. AND, the talk about some 30 thousand troops leaving is the big talking point. Well, boys and girls, that just puts us back to where we were before.
Nobody’s going anywhere, except to Iran. Period. Congress, with their slim majority can’t do a damn thing. The ONLY thing that can happen is for the Democrats to introduce impeachment legislation if ONLY to slow this President down and keep him from bombing Iran during his presidency.
You have to understand the Bush/Cheney/Rice/Rumsfeld goals. Iraq was ONLY the first step in their goals of ‘owning’ the middle east. They will stop at nothing, and will resort to anything to keep their plan going.
My question is this: If terrorism is such a big threat to our ‘livelihood’, then why aren’t we doing anything about the terrorism/genocide/disease in Africa?

Tim,

You, the Dems, and your cronies on this blog had your minds made up before Petraeus even said a word. Although I did give you credit for condemning MoveOn for their act.

Sickinone’shead, Anbar Province is not a talking point. That region is responsible for over 50% of US casualties. It has been an enemy stronghold and the US Surge is making headway there. We are not trying to “Own” the Middle East, but rather fighting back against countries that have threatened the US and our interests for decades. If Bush doesn’t do something about Iran and they attack our interests, the Dems will immediately Blame Bush for not doing anything to prevent the attack. And in case you forgot, over 70% of Americans and Congress were in favor of the war when it started, but with the Dems support and the media’s selective coverage, that has switched.

Patraeus could have said we are coming home tomorrow and you and the Dems would have found fault with that. Patraeus was doomed before he even entered the chambers of congress.

You’re at it again.

“We are not trying to “Own” the Middle East, but rather fighting back against countries that have threatened the US and our interests for decades.”

Please PLEASE read history. They are fighting back, not us. I won’t try to convince you myself, just please read some material on the subject. You can start with the CIA in 1953 if you don’t feel like going back very far. Seriously, if you care at all about the truth of this situation, do some research.

Hallzee, do you seriously want to debate this? Ok, here goes:
If we’re on their soil, how are WE the ones fighting back? Do we own that soil? Our interests have nothing to do with this debate. The fundamental question is this: Are our interests the reason for the chaos?
Nobody ever said Anbar Province wasn’t a good model. I’m saying they’re exploiting an area that has calmed down. That calming down could be because of all the deaths, and now there’s nobody to kill. Ever look at it that way? The statement was this: The surge was supposed to be designed to secure Baghdad, so the question about the surge is: Has it affected Baghdad?
You’re an absolute joke for saying the Dems would find fault if Petraeus said we’re coming home tomorrow. Get over yourself. We’re not the unpatriotic ones here. We’re the ones realizing that we’re losing lives for nothing. So how is it you find the moral fortitude to attack people who don’t want our soldiers to die??

Word, I apologize for doubting you, this site DOES delete posts. Time for me to moveon, if you’ll pardon the pun. This site has its nerve criticizing THEM and then censoring posts. Good Luck.

Yes, they DO delete posts. They deleted one of mine the other day on the contractor abuses story by MT and I can’t imagine why. I thought my mind was playing tricks on me or something. The post had nothing in it that would seem to rile Tim, except maybe because I mentioned the YouTube series of clips called “Iraq For Sale”????

That’s the onlything I could think might remotely be a reason.

Nonetheless, it’s pathetic.

Goodbye, Rolling Stone.

I meant to add:

Tim, you claim this forum is an open forum. To delete ANY post that is not potentially liable or something along those lines is despicable and calls into question everything you claim to want to promote with this forum.

There are plenty of forums around that don’t censor thir participants.

I won’t be bothering with Rolling Stone any longer.

Ok, Tim. I found it hard to believe that you would be deleting posts, but as I said, the one I posted on that MT piece– which was completely supportive of his work– disappeared. And as far as Word and his posts about the US supporting Isreal without question nor any kind of throttle, I think this is a very legitinate point of debate as well.

Naturally, I checked back to see if there was any kind of response, and I’m very happy that you assert to no censorship. I get off to this forum. I get off to Dirty Dennis and Jed and all the others, as well as the “opposition” like Merk and Alzee, etc. I think we have an enjoyable debate on the issues of the day, and I did not want to leave.

Thanks for addressing this issue and I look forward to future discussions.

“Okay,” he mumurmed petulantly, “I’ll play.”

Tnx Mac. I think we have a good core group and interesting, sometimes, conversations. I wouldn’t participate if I didn’t find it enjoyable and challenging. Unless one is a masochist, and I am not, one has to be very careful about what one says.

I think the democratic principles are strengthened with the advent of the Internet. Ppls need a place to expound no matter how inane and/or convoluted their/our thoughts may appear. I only wish more would participate.

As for this site, I found it hard to believe that there was a deliberate attempt to ‘manage’ comments. Especially given some of the absurdities that were allowed to remain. But the silence from ‘that side’ in response to Word’s and others’ laments was deafening. In the absence of assurances from Tim, what else was one to think.

Tnx Tim.

Tim,

Here are my ‘experiences’ vis a vis interacting the past couple of months.

Loading posts seems to take longer than I recall last Fall
On at least one occasion, I got ‘feedback’ that I had already loaded a particular post, even though I could find it nowhere. I made some subtle changes to the beginning and got the same response.

If the ‘post manager’ encounters too much traffic, it says so, returning you to your last position, BUT, all your comments are gone. I’m sure experienced writers copy their work until it’s safely posted.

In my instances of lost files, I discovered one was ‘missing,’ resent it and then checked to see if it was posted. It was, however, the following day, it was gone. I don’t know how long it ‘lasted’ in the thread..

I’m sure others, Word?, can expand on my observations.

Was I the only one to see “General Betrayus” has four (4) count-em, four stars now. This is how we know he is a true Bushy.

Digracefull:

General Patraeus’s military career began long before there was a Bush in office. I wish I knew how many stars were on his shoulders during the Clinton administration, maybe the three pictured above. Regardless, your suggestion that a man who’s invested his life in the military works as a pawn to a president with a maximum eight year tenure reflects your ignorance.

Abbott: Can you name one single general who has disagreed with a republican president and KEPT his stars?

Abbott: Can you name any generals who KEPT their stars, and their position after disagreeing with this president?

MoveOn did a good job and like the administration, catchy phrases seem to click…

Only, MoveOn knew where Petraeus was going with his “comments and status of the Surge”.

When he agreed to be in charge, he signed on to becoming a defender, apologist and, propaganda -pusher for Bush’s “War”.

Wall Street Journal/NBC Polls are attempting to convince us the “Surge” and Bush’s handling of the “War” are becoming supported by more Americans than a few months ago…

Murdoch owns the Journal and like his FOX fiction version of the news, polls can be set-up, too…

The networks who are sponsered or owned by the oil, weapons, military supply companies get lots of coverage perks, checks and incentives from the above-mentioned people-$War has been money and fame$ for these tycoons…

Bush has to send troops home, there will be no military left if they are all kept in Iraq…

And, just wait until the non-negotiations and non-peace talks create incidents to goad Iran into war…

How any network poll can misrepresent the numbers of Americans who want our troops home Now, is reprehensible. Murdoch and his pals should be deported back to Australia…He is one of the biggest perpetrators of arranging “news” to fit the Republican Corporate and administration agenda.

Much of the boost Bush got tuesday will be gone after his speech tonight. i agree with the people who said why make it?

Let them eat:You probably only believe polls who’s numbers agree with your views.I wonder why the N.Y.times I think had to run a poll 2x a few weeks ago about Bush’s approvals because they couldn’t accept the numbers.In response to your allegation about BIG BUSINESS :1In 02.the top ten donors to fed.candidates and political parties gave overwhelmingly to Dems..Of the $59.305,429 donated 92.4% went to Dems.7.4%went to the Reps..How about labor unions:02 $53.440.591 Dems. 94% Reps6%I could go on but you can’t accept the truth. AS far as the networks go,I know Mr. Murdoch Threw a fund raiser for Hillery about 2 mths. ago, and what is she going to do about the 850k in funds from chinaman who gave up 2mil. in bond and no one knows were it came from.I’ve never seen a add for bombs,ammo or any other hardware it takes to kill or destroy.Oil,yes [If the tree huggers would let us the U.S.drill in bumble F*** Alaska or the Gulf[oh yeah Mex and Cuba are]maybe we wouldn’t need oil from the Mid East [Just so you know most of our oil comes from Canada] Again you show your own inability to seek the truth because you’re afraid of the conclusion you might reach. Forget how we got there.I only have question DO YOU WANT TO WIN OR DO YOU WANT TO LOSE ? I can.t under stand why you blame Bush for this war,you could blame Bill Clinton,or that pu–y Carter If any one of those two took care of this nation the way Uncle Ronnie or the way G.W.is trying we wouldn’t be there now.If you can explain to me why they shouldn’t receive any blame I need a good laugh.Oh I almost forgot, Gorge Soros is the person who should sent home.He has done more to communize and undermined this nation than Rupert.

Sixinyourhand:I bet you can’t either.But I can name the people who Bill and Hill either knew intimately or were involved with that were murdered,mysteriously died,committed suicide or disappeared.Jim McDougal,Mary Caitrin Mahoney.[a intern about to go public about sexual has..Vince Foster,Ron Brown. C.Victor and Monty Raiser, Paul Tully,Ed Willey[Bill He died the same day his wife Kathleen claimed Bill groped her at the White House],Kathy Ferguson and Bill Sheltnon[they were witness in the Paula Jones case]. I could go on if you want with about 20 names.Why don’t you look up the smuggling that took place at the airport in Mena.Arkansas. Almost for got the 12 bodyguards that died of unnatural causes.I think it’s more detrimental to your health to piss off the Clintons

Hey Rolling Stone,

Thanks for removing my post on “why posts get removed.”

I almost didn’t expect that. (that’s called sarcasm kids).

Hey, Costello was the Star, Abbot was the set-up-soooo:

Are you trying to be the Funny man, with your Blame Bill and Hillary Puff Fiction, you are the Funny One… And, we are laughing At You!

This is Now, Face the Facts and see what George has done-Not Good, fella, concentrate on 2000 to 2007 Flop, Disaster, Destruction and, Corruption, hmmm!

You got Us Laughing, though!

Hey, if Dirty Dennis and Mac leave, it is less input from the world and we all lose.

Every post(whether you agree or disagree)has a value and gives us a view of how others are interpreting the news coming at us and who has the real picture of what is going on-Debate is great-Diversity is utmost!

Don’t leave-then you let the Censors “Win”…

Abbott: What the fuck are you talking about? You’re defending this war by saying Bill and Hill are criminals? I’ll be damned if that isn’t a conflict of interest.
Who gives a FUCK what the Clintons did, allegedly. Did they LIE us into a war? Did they exploit a national tragedy to enrich their cronies? Did they strip our country of civil liberties if only to control the media? Did they intentionally support both sides of the chaotic middle east?
It’s time to wake up and deal the facts: You Bushmills supports are in the MAJOR minority. Over 70% of the people in the United States want us out of Iraq. Period. I would imagine that number would be greater in that part of the world. So, if you can’t support your cause with justifiable facts, then just be a good soldier and go down with the ship.

Cake,

Please don’t forget that Petraeus was Unanimously Confirmed by Congress because they believed he was Trustworthy, Non-Partisan and showed Credibility. Now all of a sudden the Same Democrats who Unanimously Confirmed him are questioning his Credibility prior to him even giving a status report in order to achieve Liberal Political Gain.

Funny how the Democrats believe that Petraeus’ testimony was pre-ordained as if their response wasn’t.

Your Congress is a Do-Nothing Congress that is acting more like a Lame-Duck Congress rather than one that was recently elected. Elected based on promises of an end to the War and Impeachment of Bush. How is that coming along?

C’mon Hallzee, I asked you once before, who got elected on a campaign platform of impeachment? If you’re not going to name names, knock off that crap.

As for a do-nothing Congress, DUH!! They have a majority of ONE in the Senate and Lieberman’s gone over to the other side. They can’t do anything legislatively, but they can sure hold Busney’s feet to the fire and that’s exactly what they’re doing.

Quit with the dogging of Congress. That’s like whipping a junkyard dog.

By the by, I just read the other day that this Congress, in the same time frame and the Contract With America Congress, has passed more legislation. Just thought you might be interested.

Oh Filthy One,

I’m sorry, I should have said re-elected on a Platform of Impeachment. Pelosi, Kicinich, Reed, and the witch from Maine to name a few. I will admit Kicinich is still sticking to his guns on impeaching the President.

Now your turn. Besides the Minimum Wage Bill, what useful Legislation has this Congress passed?
(And don’t assume that I consider the Minimum Wage Bill useful legislation).

I miss Sickinone’shead

Hallzee, This congress passed a stemcell bill and a generous budget and passed an anti war bill all were veted.

Filthy One? That would be Moi, I presume?

Tnx Ray. For the record, Hallzee, I never claimed that this was a do-something Congress, quite the contrary. They CAN’T do anything because they control but one portion of Congress. And for that Bushney should be thankful else he’d be up on charges by now.

Dennis: You’ll have to forgive Hallzee. He hasn’t learned to swim yet and is just flapping in the shallow end of the pool. He also hasn’t learned how to actually read articles. He only sees headlines.

No Coach, you discredit him. He also listens to Rush.

“Can I go in now, Coach? Huh? Huh? Can I? Can I?”

Halzee,

Wasn’t Powell Congress-approved?

And look what happened to him when he was set-up to read “Cooked” info on Iraq & Niger.

In regards to Petraeus, he had the choice to Comply with Bush and his failing “strategery” or refuse command or resign out of good conscience(many have in the past three years).

Petraeus’s boss, Adm. Falon/Falco did not mince words regarding his opinion of Petraeus’s service record and the current Plight.(—kissing was one of the adm.s descriptions of Petraeus.

Bush and his cronies seem to bring out the Worst in the people who are lured into association with them.(It’s a Red Flag every time for Career Disaster and World Chaos).

Ok Tim, this is getting ridiculous.

I wrote a nice long post about how I predict Petraeus and Powell will parralel in their careers after testifying to congress.

IT TOO DISAPPEARED.

TELL YOU WHAT, TIM, I’LL PERIODICALLY CHECK BACK TO SEE IF THE SITUATION HAS CHANGED, BUT UNTIL I SEE IT HAS BEEN CORRECTED, I WILL NO LONGER POST MY THOUGHTS ON RS.

YOU NEED TO SERIOUSLY LOOK OVER AND EVALUATE THE SYSTEM HERE, GUY.

Let Them Eat: No I was not trying to be funny.But it’s obvious you still can’t give me any facts. The proof is there: B.C. could have killed Os Bin. at least 4 different times. But the only time he uses his balls is in an intern’s mouth, not to provide a safe nation. So if you want talk about corruption, read my response to Sixhand and do your own search. There was more corruption in Clinton’s admin. than I think you can find in G.W.’s:. Here is a snapshot of Bill’s admin.:1. HE lied to The American people and Congress about Lewinsky. 2. Lied under oath in the Paula Jones .vs Clinton case.3. He obstructed justice,tampered with and intimidated witnesses and that was only in P.J vs Clinton. 4. He took donations from drug dealers,spies and international arms dealers. 5. He bombed Kosovo to deflect attn.from pol.problems 6. He repeatedly perjured himself,was in contempt of court and had credible rape charges brought against him. Despite what your beliefs are, you still can’t change the fact that Clinton was the first president in U.S. history to be impeached, disbarred from practicing law and the first to pay $800,000 to settle a sexual harassment claim. His admin holds the all time record for having the largest number of asso. who have: resigned under fire;pleaded the fifth;gone to jail or died under mysterious circumstances. So if you want to talk about corruption, give me something to laugh about. There is no administration with a perfect record, but compared to Slick Willie, President Bush is a great improvement.

P.S. I wasn’t surprised that your response attacked me rather than the issues I presented. That’s the liberal way. In addition, you still haven’t answered this question: do you want to win the war?

Abbott!

Clinton’s approval rating is still very high.

In comparison to his “predecessor”, he is Aces ahead.

If you want to compare what the Clinton Presidency gave us, you had better plan for a flood of positives to your Bush Disaster.

Even Democracy took a back seat to two “Elections” that were so mired in Diebolds, ballots discard(hundreds of thousands-valid), Rep. election “officals” taking absentee ballots home to keep them “company”, it was A Cheat Event for the GOP.

Check “Bush, lies” and see how many Hits you get.

How many Americans died because of Lewinsky?

How many Americans, Iraqis, New Orleans residents died because of Bush’s Bad and Evil Decisions about Iraq, New Orleans, deregulation-no oversight, the lack of aid from the administration for the people who went near the Towers, etc.

The economy has been robbed, the stats are showing the real “employment” situation, the infra-structure has been sucked dry, the “War” has been put on “Forever” status, the Bush/Cheney duo are salivating to get Iran(To the Objection of most of the Country and Congress), Education and Health care are getting zip but the billions keep going into “fighting oil terror in Iraq”(oil, weapons, Repube politicians getting rich).

Clinton gave us a good economy, a balanced economy, the infra-structure was good, the health care industry was being addressed until the pharms, the insurance lobbyists and their employers spent a billion going after Hillary to hide their greed, wars were to stop genecide and not for Oil Profits, peace was the goal, U.S. credibility was great, education was full of scholarships, grants tax-funding, real elections and, Prosperity.

Are you related to George W?

Your info is sraight from FOX FICTION.

“General Betrayus” is a good description-he is no better than any of the other generals who have gone along with the hype from the regime-let’s not deify him!

Sick of the gutless wonders who are afraid to say “Boo” to Bush or his “appointees, administration”.

Censorship stinks and is the product of a Dictatorship.

There are plenty of generals who have Resigned to stand up for their beliefs and knowledge.

FOX and this administratin want No One To Disagree with their policies or apointees.

Censorship has been on the rise since Bushdum took over-Sally Fields can’t even give her view on the idiocy of Bush’s “War”

Peace rallies attended by hundreds of thousands, haven’t been covered accurately or with much or any attention.

And, good for Barry Manilow!

Let’s have more celebreties speaking out-extensive travel and awareness do qualify.

Bush apologists need to look at what they are making excuses for!

Abbott,

You seem to place a premium on winning. I want to END the war, winning is irrelevant because there is no way to determine ‘victory.’ What, our troops riding through towns being showered with flowers by winsome lasses? Iraq is NO different than Nam. There is NO benchmark for success.

If ‘winning’ is the installation of a ‘democratic’ government, then you and I will be dust long before that happens. Democracy evolves, you can’t ‘install’ it. The only measure of success is the cessation of hostilities and since they were instigated by this country, it would seem logical that they could be halted by this country.

It’s time for this country to be BIG for a change, big in heart, big in soul and big in spirit. NOT big with force.

As for the Dems role in all this, I will give you that many voted for the war if you will give me that they were lied to, knowingly or not. And I would trust the decisions of a Dem administration FAR more than I would of Bushney who is bent on a fanatical quest to establish his ‘legacy.’

dirty Dennis:I knew you would not respond you never kept score.FIELD FAIRY!!!!

Народ в подобных случаях так говорит – Баба гневалась на торг, а торг того и не ведает.