WHAT-THE-F*CK!

It’s political manipulations like these (way back in the 60’s and 70’s) that created the all the tensions and violence in the Mideast to begin with!

I sorry, but Republicans and the CIA never learn.

Or maybe the destabilization of emerging countries is all part of the grand scheme for the Neo-cons: “Prevent other countries from threatening America’s place as the world’s leading economy by undermining their governments and sublimating their people”.

How ironic that the Right- who always seem to accuse those who disagree with their views as “Al-Qaeda and terrorist sympathizers”- are actively supporting an administration that finances our enemy so they can buy more bombs to kill our own troops. When will Republicans put America before their party and dump Bush and his gang of fools?

i dont see how this comes as some sort of surprise…this has been happening since the modern state was invented

its the nature of politics, in the machiavellian sense–you do whatever suits the situation the best, and gains you the upper hand, and if that means supporting one enemy over another, playing them off each other, so be it… it may seem hipocritical, but thats the way the world works, and always has

Let us not forget that the U.S., in order to oust the Soviet Union from Afghanistan, bankrolled and armed OBL in the late 70’s and 80’s, then lost interest and let things grow from there.

TLC

When do we Impeach/Vote Out the Insane Bush administration?

We are funding the Saudis who are providing the Sunnis with arms and killing our Troops…

Bush and Cheney In their latest “Road” trip, “the Road to Annhilation” are intent to initiate War and Doom on the World…

Oil, military, munitions/defense is cheering this on-they all have been drinking out of the same Cup..

Money and greed and power lust are fueling this mess and will push it until something blows Nuclear…

Hey is James Cameron a Republican-his latest crock of “theory” will help divert the Headlines into more wasted Hot Air Time for the Bush Networks?….

Better the American Peoples attention is on a baseless “theory” and not aware and ready to let Congress know the Chimp in Charge and his apes need to take a walk from the Presidency and, enjoy Civilian Life-quick, before they do anymore harm…

Anything to get the public’s minds on exploitation of Anna Nicole Smith, Britney Spears and, James Cameron’s latest goony theory-don’t think about our Country, what is going on with a looming Large War, The Bush threesome and, their slithering out of being Charge as Traitors(Libby and friends may get a “mistrial”)and more inaction in Impeaching Incompetents…

Things are moving along, swimmingly-and guess who is drowning Americans in danger and subversions and lies…(?)

I have been following the story since it broke. In a survey of news, other than CNN (where Wolf had an interview with Sy), this is the only “big” news source that is carrying the story. When you are depending on Rolling Stone to get major events to the public, something is seriously wrong.

Iran-contratastic! Who is going to play Olli North? I’m thinking Negraponte.

This is the same short-sighted crap that Regan did that got us here in the first place.

I agree with almost everything here, except the talk of political parties. These parties are just there to make it easier for the MAN to manipulate us by lowering the amount of choices…..so when you say Republicans, realize that Democrats is just there to make Americans feel they have a choice. I mean, the most liberal candidate in the race is Republican (Ron Paul). We are at war with the constant billions of dollars that are spent each year to brainwash/manipulate the public to agree with the MAN’s agenda.

Oh, and if you are going to Rolling stone for your news(which i admit is better then cnn,msnbc,cnbc,& of course fox), you really should check out thinkprogress.org or infowars.com

Kieth Olberman also ran a piece on this last night.

Funding Al Queda is treason. Pure and simple. If any American funded the same extremists in Lebanon the Cheney administration now wants to, they would be tried by a military tribunal. It is not cynical or based on national security (Iran did not attack us on 9/11 and now we are indirectly funding those who did). It’s not geopolitics either otherwise we’d have attacked Iran before Iraq (Iran supplies Russia and China with much of their oil).

Why do we think Iran is so dangerous anyway? There were elements within that country that WANTED to open up and make peace with the U.S. and they showed it by supporting the war against Afghanistan. Iran knows it will take at least a few nukes if it attacks us directly and their financing of terrorism is less aimed at the U.S.-The majority of those attacking U.S. troops in Iraq are Sunni not Iranian Shiite-and more aimed at attacking Israel.

Hey wait, maybe that’s why we attacked Iraq first-they were the only country within scud range of Israel.

Is this why Iran is so dangerous that we’d start FUNDING the people who flew planes into our buildings on 9-11 (all of whom were Sunni). Israel? Is Israel that important that we’d fund Sunnis attacking U.S. troops in Iraq? Is Israel more important than POSSIBLY FUNDING ANOTHER 9-11????

FUCK NO.

If there is any other reason we are going to attack Iran please let me know. This shit makes me absolutely sick to my stomach.

I agree

word

Get better media;

“Frontline” addressed “Journalism Today”(2/27/07)-PBS

How little “Hard News” is on any of the networks, the history and “demise” of good journalism-given way to Corporate Interests and, the replacement of real professional journalists.

Where the internet plays a part and what kind of audience it is attracting/influencing…

T his is a time when people need to contact the networks to let them know how “Tabloid” and unprofessional mainstream news has become and, encourage their senators and reps to investigate the FCC and, pass legislation for less Corporate Involvement and attempt to break up the monopolies that are giving Only One Voice and Slant to the news…(A Conservative Block owns and controls the news and other programming)It Shows and it is strictly sloppy and rightie political propaganda.

Look, I’ll keep this short because this shit website removes my posts as much as it can.

PROVE TO ME ISRAEL IS NOT BEHIND OUR ATTACKING IRAN. PROVE IT.

Should Americans fund Al Quaeda for the sake of Israel?

NO!

Speaking of political propaganda, since when did the Academy Awards become a news and/or opinion program? Aren’t those supposed to be shown on Sunday mornings? I guess they didn’t want to be outdone by the Grammy’s and their lovefest with the Dixie Sluts. If Al decides to run Rudy will need equal time at next years show! Can you even imagine? He’d fit in like Bryant Gumbel at the Winter Games…

it has happened every time the country has been at war. just as the films put out have been in some way or another a commentary on the war or the society involved in the war. It’s not new at all doc.

Dr. Ralph-

“Physician, heal thyself”…

The Corporate network heads have managed to stifle so many of the voices of the brilliant and talented movie industry, it was a Breath of Fresh Air to hear some Much-needed represention of seventy per cent the country -Poitical Commentary.

The Awards show spoke for the masses, darling, and not the Conservative Elite that have suckered our Country out of needed services to slather themselves in Riches…

(And don’t forget your Bush Tax-Cut Welfare System for he and his rich friends and Corporations)…
Sick of nothing but Cons Smothering the network news in absolute Fascist Propaganda….

People had better wake up quick, ’cause Bush and his pals will be the ones to create an attack here or, something as sinister….Nothing but Cons….

Chris Matthews, Beck, Carlson, Sarborough, Russert, Blitzer, King, and everyone on FOX, have bogged down the political “commentaries” to Republican Tripe/Propaganda….

The last five years of awards shows were Bland and Benign and Boring…(Oscar stepped up to the plate and delivered some realistic HomeRuns…Go, Baby!

Yesterday our “Wonderful Bush Economy(For the Rich, By the Rich) got Hit UpSide the Head by China…

It let us all know how Bush and his pals have given Control to China and they let us know how much they want us to leave Iran alone…

Bush and Cheney have bungled yet, another Strength we once had…

Funding our enemies, the Trade deficit, the attempt to Shut-Up the outcry of our wounded veterens-the tax cut damage the military is experiencing(especially the vets who have served their country and have come back wounded in more ways than one).

But Cheney and Halliburton have filled their collective pockets(Bush and family, too)-that’s been their primary goal and accomplishment since cheating in, in 2000….

The tax cuts have sucked the infra-structure Dry(That includes soldiers benefits, health care(everyone’s health care, education)…

Hey, but Bush and Cheney refer to any of the population, here as “giving aid to the enemy”…
(Who’s your Daddy?-and just who is giving aid to the enemy, Mr. Cheney/Bush?(Don’t forget Rove, the Troll)…

Mr. Seymour Hersh has a very frightening habit of being professional and correct. If this article, one of the most important in the last several decades, is up to his normal standards, spend time in prayer, and with the ones you love, because we may all be looking God eyeball to eyeball in the very near future. To put this in terms Rolling Stone readers may appreciate: Bob Dylan has always been well ahead of the cultural and political curve. Modern Times can be aptly considered to be an apolyptic album. Consider the lyric line “While the world goes dark before my eyes”. I have grown old and tired of evil Satanic egomanical monsters claiming God is on their side while they call young men and women to die for their cause. Now it is the leadership of my own country. Please, God, and Americans, help stop this instanity before we prove the last chapter of the Bible is indeed prophetic and literal.

Damn those Chinese! 400 points? And just when my mutual funds were getting right… better call Vanguard!

Hope you don’t have your retirement fixed on the stock market only, ie. 401Ks. (the way things are going, it may just tank in the next few years if we keep blowing money on forcing others do as we want them to)
One nice thing about pension was that, supposedly, they increased reagardless of other factors at a steady rate. Too bad companies weren’t compelled to actually fund them as the law required. When a corp goes bankrupt these days, the tax payer has to pony up for most of their pension and the people that were expecting plenty of money to retire on find themselves working at walmart to make ends meet.

The “patroitic fuckers” are not on RS.com or reading the New Yorker. If this story was more credible it would be on the national news (where they would see it).

Also, if by thinking America can make mistakes and still be a noble country makes me a con or a fucker, please tell me.

I’ll tell you where we’re not Word 1. Hiding out at a conservative website swimming down stream. You get on RS and cheer your team while we get on and fight the good fight. Grow some balls and try to impress someone not in your mutual admiration society. My horse won the race and I’m still backing him!

Sy Hersh should always be read with enough time to fact check after.

WITNESS THE “ANBAR SALVATION COUNCIL”.

Sunni tribes of Anbar turn against al Qaida and towards US and Iraqi view.

Less the a year ago many of these tribes were on the side of al Qaeda. They have tired of Al Qaida tactics of murdering civillians.

Sheik Sattar is the most prime example. However, there are plenty of others. Roughly 30 of 36 anbar tribes joined the US and Iraqi govt. THAT’S SUNNIS FIGHTING WITH/FOR THE SHI’ITE LED GOVT.

The middle east is a muddy part of the world.

Mr. Hersh may have a few points about Lebanon. However, his story leaves much to be desired.

He claims, “Membership in the Brotherhood in Syria is punishable by death”.

Really?!?!?! Tell that to Khaled Meshaal. Hamas is a branch of the Muslim Brotherhood. There are no less that 15 terror groups based out of Syria, many have ties to the Muslim Brotherhood. Hama was a long time ago, and Syria has repositioned itself since then.

How about the fact that Iran and Syria are playing both sides of the sectarian divide. Most Sunni terrorists enter Iraq through Syria, most Shi’ites enter through Iran, yet Iran and Syria are about the only allies each other have in the region: they are in close coordination trying to manage the chaos in Iraq. They are trying to force a US retreat before a stable democracy is in place.

Sy Hersh occasionally comes up with a story that’s newsworthy. If he payed a little more attention to responsible detail, rational people might take him more seriously.

Gary Jacobs,

“It seems like you may be Iranian yourself. Judging by your statement on this board, and then the other claiming “jews control the media and that’s how Iran will be presented as a threat”.

You are a facist. Attempting to lump me in with an antisemite and to tar me as an Iranian will get you my fist through your teeth.

Backing Sunni extremists to Al Qaeda’s benefit just to fight Iran is a direct endorsement of Israel’s security over the United States’. There is no true American who will choose Israel’s security over the United States, yet that is the choice that has been made. Fuck you. Go back to Israel, “American.”

Gary-fascist spelled right-Jacobs,

“Sheik Sattar is the most prime example. However, there are plenty of others. Roughly 30 of 36 anbar tribes joined the US and Iraqi govt. THAT’S SUNNIS FIGHTING WITH/FOR THE SHI’ITE LED GOVT.”

What’s hilarious about you is that you are so surgically stupid it’s breathtaking. You don’t believe shit Sunnis-or any Arabs for that matter- say. You’ve said so in your past posts. You’re choosing to believe them now because it would aid in attacking Iran which is your ultimate goal. Taking on faith that Al Qaeda affiliates will simply stop trying to attack the U.S. is the definition of stupidity.

And were you an American, you’d realize that attacking Iran-and subsequently disrupting thier oil output-would cause a global recession. China imports most of its oil from Iran and last week we saw what can happen if Chinese markets are unstable. Were you an American, you’d put your countries’ health before that of Israel.

And since my last post got deleted (soon to reappear probably), you can answer this question: If Israel is so freaked out about Iran, WHY DON’T THEY ATTACK THEM?

Wordc 1:

Somehow, you seem to think Sy Hersh should be read as if he writes the Gospel truth.

Sy Hersh should always be read with enough time to fact check after.

WITNESS THE “ANBAR SALVATION COUNCIL”.

Sunni tribes of Anbar turn against al Qaida and towards US and Iraqi view.

Less the a year ago many of these tribes were on the side of al Qaeda. They have tired of Al Qaida tactics of murdering civillians.

Sheik Sattar is the most prime example. However, there are plenty of others. Roughly 30 of 36 anbar tribes joined the US and Iraqi govt. THAT’S SUNNIS FIGHTING WITH/FOR THE SHI’ITE LED GOVT.

Try reading about reality a little more.

Word 1:

BTW your assertion that everything is being done for Israel’s security, or “that’s the choice being made” is possibly the most pathetic statement I have heard in quite some time.

You call me a fascist, yet I couold go back to all kinds of Nazi footage, and find statements just like the ones you make.

GROW UP. GET YOUR READ ON, AND LEARN SOMETHING REAL.

“LEARN SOMETHING REAL”

Yeah, like what’s printed on RS or the New York Times.

Word 1:

If you actually paid attention to my past posts, you would notice that I choose not to give up hope at this time. Especially in Iraq.

Sometimes it takes people learning the hard way for them to get it through their thick skulls. LIKE YOU FOR INSTANCE, or Sheik Sattar, Hamas and the “Pals” may take longer.

I have clearly stated there are reasons for CAUTIOUS optimism.

Sheik Sattar, The Islamic Army in Iraq, The 1929 Brigades, there are many Sunni Factions in Iraq. Sometimes their interests have aligned, sometimes not.

It seems we have reached a turning point in Anbar. Lets take a cautious approach and see how things go. That’s in sharp contrast to your spastic spewing of defeatist propaganda.

BTW I have also clearly stated multiple times that I do NOT think that an attack on Iran is a good thing right now.

Anyblaze, The Iranians are probably shaking in their goose stepping jack-boots right now as western Intel agencies [probably the Mossad got him out in the first place] interview Ali Reza Asghari.

Asghari could be the single most important defector to the west in decades. His info will either help make war completely uncecessary [my actual hope], or as short as possible [last resort].

You have still failed to respond to the complete and total dcestruction of your assertions about “Israel controlling the Media” on 101 ways to lie about america [although it says iraq] by Matt Tiabbi about Israel controlling the media

You are still on rookie status. You seem to see things in black and white when the world is grey. Your lack of sophistication and experience are transparent.

Word 1:

“inferior brain” you say from the Libby page.

AH… FASCISM AT ITS FINEST.

Speaking to the inferiority of people. HOW NAZI OF YOU.

You are living in a dellusional dream land that is not worth me wasting my time any more.

YOU WOULDN’T KNOW WHAT A FACT IS IF IT SAT ON YOUR FACE AND WIGGLED.

get a life -ONE THAT HAS A FEW FACTS AND A LITTLE LESS RACISM

The funding of Al Qaeda to attack Iran is a direct endorsement of Israel’s national security over that of the united States’. This is not a partisan issue; this is an issue of national security.

That more people are not outraged the administration that once said “you are either with us or you are with the terrorists” is now funding groups affiliated with Al Qaeda is more than scary. It is Orwellian.

Word 1:

Huh? You continue to prove your racism by claiming everything is about Israel.

Your statements are nothing short of spastic and incoherent.

Blaming things on Israel and ignoring the facts laid out below is infintile.

Word 1:

If you actually paid attention to my past posts, you would notice that I choose not to give up hope at this time. Especially in Iraq.

Sometimes it takes people learning the hard way for them to get it through their thick skulls. LIKE YOU FOR INSTANCE, or Sheik Sattar, Hamas and the “Pals” may take longer.

I have clearly stated there are reasons for CAUTIOUS optimism.

Sheik Sattar, The Islamic Army in Iraq, The 1929 Brigades, there are many Sunni Factions in Iraq. Sometimes their interests have aligned, sometimes not.

It seems we have reached a turning point in Anbar. Lets take a cautious approach and see how things go. That’s in sharp contrast to your spastic spewing of defeatist propaganda.

BTW I have also clearly stated multiple times that I do NOT think that an attack on Iran is a good thing right now.

Anyblaze, The Iranians are probably shaking in their goose stepping jack-boots right now as western Intel agencies [probably the Mossad got him out in the first place] interview Ali Reza Asghari.

Asghari could be the single most important defector to the west in decades. His info will either help make war completely uncecessary [my actual hope], or as short as possible [last resort].

You have still failed to respond to the complete and total dcestruction of your assertions about “Israel controlling the Media” on 101 ways to lie about america [although it says iraq] by Matt Tiabbi about Israel controlling the media

You are still on rookie status. You seem to see things in black and white when the world is grey. Your lack of sophistication and experience are transparent.

[This post was an easy cut-and-paste. Obviously you just like to read what you want - so I will repeat reality again]

The funding of Al Qaeda to attack Iran is a direct endorsement of Israel’s national security over that of the united States’. This is not a partisan issue; this is an issue of national security.

That more people are not outraged the administration that once said “you are either with us or you are with the terrorists” is now funding groups affiliated with Al Qaeda is more than scary. It is Orwellian.

Gary,

Yes or no question:

Do you agree with the U.S.’s funding of Al Qaeda affiliated groups?

Yes or no. And don’t give me bullshit about how complicated the world is. You either do or you don’t agree.

Word 1:

Huh? You continue to prove your racism by claiming everything is about Israel.

Your statements are nothing short of spastic and incoherent.

Blaming things on Israel and ignoring the facts laid out below is infintile.

Gary,

Yes or no question:

Do you agree with the U.S.’s funding of Al Qaeda affiliated groups?

Yes or no. And don’t give me bullshit about how complicated the world is. You either do or you don’t agree.

Gary,

Again, yes or no. Do you agree with U.S. funding of Al Qaeda affiliated groups?

Since Sept. ‘06, the U.S. has carrier fleets, in the middle east, we have attacked a neighboring country to Iran(without warrant-no WMDS, no Connection with 9/11 or bin Laden,no intent on ultruistic liberation nor improvement for the Iraqis, only oil-grabbing and Control of the oil)And War-Profiteering by Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld…

Let Them Eat Propaganda – I mean Cake:

So you claim Saddam had no connection to al Qaida huh?

Consider what a top al Qaeda operative, Abu Zubaydah, told his CIA interrogators after his capture in March 2002. According to the Senate Intelligence Report, Zubaydah said “he was not aware of a relationship between Iraq and al-Qaeda.” But, he added that “any relationship would be highly compartmented and went on to name al Qaeda members who he thought had good contacts with the Iraqis.” Zubaydah “indicated that he heard that
an important al-Qaida associate, Abu Mus’ab al-Zarqawi, and others had GOOD RELATIONSHIPS WITH IRAQI INTELLIGENCE.”

Zubaydah’s testimony has since been further corroborated by a known al Qaeda ideologue, Dr. Muhammad al-Masari. Al-Masari operated the Committee for the Defense of Legitimate Rights, a Saudi oppositionist group and al Qaeda front, out of London for more than decade. He told the editor-in-chief of Al-Quds Al-Arabi that Saddam “established contact with the ‘Afghan Arabs’ as early as 2001, believing he would be targeted by the US once the Taliban was routed.” Furthermore, “Saddam funded Al-Qaeda operatives to move into Iraq with the proviso that they would not undermine his regime.”

Al-Masari claimed that Saddam’s regime actively aided Zarqawi and his men prior to the war and fully included them in his plans for a terrorist insurgency. He said Saddam “saw that Islam would be key to a cohesive resistance in the event of invasion.” Iraqi officers bought “small plots of land from farmers in Sunni areas” and they buried “arms and money caches for later use by the resistance.”

Al-Masari also claimed that “Iraqi army commanders were ordered to become practicing Muslims and to adopt the language and spirit of the jihadis.”

Just as Saddam ordered, many of Iraq’s senior military and intelligence personnel joined or aided Zarqawi’s jihad. Many of the more prominent supporters and members of Zarqawi’s al Qaeda branch, in fact, came from the upper echelon of Saddam’s regime. Izzat Ibrahim al-Douri (aka the “King of Clubs”) and his sons allied with Zarqawi, as did members of Muhammad Hamza Zubaydi’s (aka the “Queen of Spades”) family. Zarqawi’s allies included Muhammed Hila Hammad Ubaydi, who was an aide to Saddam’s chief of staff of intelligence, and some of his more lethal operatives served as officers in Saddam’s military, including Abu Ali, “Al-Hajji” Thamer Mubarak (whose sister attempted a martyrdom operation in Jordan), Abu-Ubaidah, and Abdel Fatih Isa.

THESE BAATHISTS, and others, have spilled much blood in Zarqawi’s name. Their attacks were among “Zarqawi’s” most successful, including an assault on the Abu Ghraib prison and the first attack on the U.N.’s headquarters. The latter strike was among al Qaeda’s earliest, killing Sergio de Mello, the U.N.’s special representative in Baghdad, in August 2003.

In addition to Abu Zubaydah and Muhammad al-Masri, a third high-ranking al Qaeda associate has explained Saddam’s support for al Qaeda prior to the war. Hudayfa Azzam, who is the son of one of al Qaeda’s earliest and most influential leaders, Adullah Azzam, gave an interview with Agence France Presse in August 2004 in which he explained Saddam’s support for al Qaeda’s members as they relocated to Iraq:

“Saddam Hussein’s regime welcomed them with open arms,” Azzam explained, “and young al Qaeda members entered Iraq in large numbers, setting up an organization to confront the occupation.” Al Qaeda’s terrorists “infiltrated into Iraq with the help of Kurdish mujahideen from Afghanistan, across mountains in Iran.” Once in Iraq, Saddam “strictly and directly” controlled their activities, Azzam added.

Curiously, in all of the coverage of Zarqawi’s death there has been no mention of Abu Zubaydah’s, Muhammad al-Masri’s, or Hudayfa Azzam’s comments. This is not entirely surprising. Many of the basic facts surrounding Zarqawi’s early days in Iraq have been muddled by those vested in the notion that Saddam’s Iraq never supported al Qaeda.

Even when al Qaeda terrorists themselves admit that Saddam offered them safe haven
and support, THEIR WORDS fall on the mainstream media’s deaf ears.

See Ken Timmerman’s article: Politicizing Intelligence Yet Again

This should add some perspective for you…

Gary,

As almost every one except you and Dick Cheney knows, Al Qeada would have LOVED to assassinate Saddam. They hated him and everything he stood for. He knew it, every one else knows it, and your utterly full of BS to assert otherwise.

Iran is no threat to the US or Israel. They have no nukes, (While Israel has 200 or so) and have not attacked another country for about 250 years. We, on the other hand, financed and supplied Saddams war against against Iran, which resulted in a million casualties on both sides. It makes 9/11, which was horrific, look pale in comparison. Ironically, we were also secretly supplying weapons to Iran during that war, which probably explains Saddams irrational paranoia about the US and its intentions.

Instead of trying so desperatley and transparently to justify FURTHER futile and counterproductive wars in the middle east based on the same type of lies that got us into Iraq, Why don’t we try something that will actually WORK?

The Iraq Study Group, Bill Clinton, Dennis Kucinich, Jimmy Carter, Colin Powell, Desmond TUTU, Pat Buchanan, Jonathan Tasini, and virtually every other country in the world other than the US and Israel believe that the engine of middle eastern terrorist recruitment and funding is the Israeli Palestinian conflict, which has been maintained by the constant growth of the Isreali settlement movement, which is not even supported by a majority of Israelis and is CONDEMNED by the rest of the world.

How about we cut off all funding to Israel until they agree to tear down every settlement in the West Bank and East Jerusalem and quit the occupation entirely. The settlements are Morally reprehensible, and stand in contradiction to every principle that the US holds dear, and have only succeeded in driving M.E. terrorism to the point that led to 9/11.

The day we force Israel to finally comply with what has been long term official US policy, ie the termination and removal of the settlements and occupation, will be the day that the US and Israel will become more secure, regain the moral highground, and also the first day of the begining of the end of the war on terrorism.

Or, I guess we could go your route, and fight endless unwinable wars against a never ending lineup of imaginary enemies in the middle east until we are a shadow of our former self both economically and morally.

Gary,

There is not a SINGLE credible member of the US intelligence community that currently believes that there were any ties between Al Qeada and Saddam. As I said before, They HATED him and would have gladly killed him. There were Al Queada sympathizers in Iraq, although they happened to be located in the Kurdish North, PROTECTED BY THE US and unavailable to Saddam. They were FIGHTING SADDAM.

Even Douglas Feith, one of the Prime people responsible for floating the debunked idea of a Al queada Saddam Connection, now conceeds that his information was flawed.

The Pentagons report to the senate regarding Feiths assertions while heading the OSP in no uncertain terms makes clear that Feith was nearly criminally mistaken about such assertions.

His cohort, Larry Franklin, was found guilty of espionage against the US for giving classified US intel on Iran to top members of AIPAC and The Israeli Ambassador. The two aipac officials will soon also be tried for their crimes agaisnt the US. The FBI and CIA asserted that Larry, Like yourself, wanted to use the information to create counter intel that might spark support for further wars in the middle east.

Regardng your equivocations, obfuscations and apparent beliefs about any shred of moral justification for the Israeli settlements, well, take it up with vitually every other nation on earth, Bill Clinton, Bush senior, Dennis Kucinich, Jimmy Carter, Pat Buchanan, Colin Powell, The Iraq Study Group, and the Majority of Israelis and Jewish Americans, all of whom are of the opinion that they are the primary engine for Middle eastern terrorism.

You are VERY isolated in your reading of the facts on every matter you attempt to discuss and your lame justification of the Settlements clearly indicate that your happy to consign the Palestinian people to decades more apartheid and ethnic cleansing, while exposing the US to needless M. E. terrorism.

Desmond TuTu, a real expert on Apartheid, thinks that the settlements and the occuaption that support them are WORSE than what happened in South Africa. The majority all nations on the planet agree with him as evidenced by their numerous votes in the UN.

Face it. Your a war monger and an advocate of apartheid, speaking for the furthest right wing of Israeli Politics, while ignoring the welfare of all other Israelis, Palestinians, US Citizens, and for that matter, the rest of the world.

Justtellthetruth:

BTW… your attempts to distort what Douglas Feith, and his comclusions, are rather rediculous.

It’s ironic that the big problem leading up to the war in Iraq was this so-called “group think” and then the guy who is presenting an opposing view is viewed as criminal.

AFTER ALL THE MISTAKES THE CIA HAS MADE, TO CLAIM THE PENTAGON HAS NO RIGHT TO COME UP WITH ITS OWN ASSESMENTS IS INSANE…

THAT’S HOW MORE PEOPLE WILL DIE IN TERROR ATTACKS.

WAKE UP AND SMELL THE BURNING FLESH OF THE INFIDEL…

Justtellthetruth:

I noticed a little irony in th fact that instead of talking about the al-Qaeda members admitting that Saddam helped them, you revert back to Douglas Feith as a whipping boy, speaking of OBFUSCATING…

Adullah Azzam [son of al-Qaeda "spiritual" leader], gave an interview with Agence France Presse in August 2004 in which he explained Saddam’s support for al Qaeda’s members as they relocated to Iraq:

“Saddam Hussein’s regime welcomed them with open arms,” Azzam explained, “and young al Qaeda members entered Iraq in large numbers, setting up an organization to confront the occupation.” Al Qaeda’s terrorists “infiltrated into Iraq with the help of Kurdish mujahideen from Afghanistan, across mountains in Iran.” Once in Iraq, Saddam “strictly and directly” controlled their activities, Azzam added.

Curiously, in all of the coverage of Zarqawi’s death there has been no mention of Abu Zubaydah’s, Muhammad al-Masri’s, or Hudayfa Azzam’s comments. This is not entirely surprising. Many of the basic facts surrounding Zarqawi’s early days in Iraq have been muddled by those vested in the notion that Saddam’s Iraq never supported al Qaeda.

Even when al Qaeda terrorists themselves admit that Saddam offered them safe haven
and support, THEIR WORDS fall on the mainstream media’s deaf ears.

Your reading of the facts is in direct contradiction to the CIA’s, FBI’s, and virtually the entire US government at this juncture. The pentagon disagrees with you. The vast majority of the news media disagrees with you. Virtually every nation on earth disagrees with you.

If you want to keep repeating these spurious notions until you believe them, thats up to you, but dont expect the rest of the world to share in your delusions.

Instead, lets tear down the settlements, end the occupation, and put a stop to the engine that drives M.E. terrorism. The settlements are Apartheid that the US has helped pay for and they are bringing nothing but pain and suffering upon the US and Israel, not to mention Palestine.

Gary,

A few Facts you may have not considered; there were at least 19 members of Al Qeada here before 9/11 taking flight classes, enrolled in school, Even with contacts in the military. Does that indicate that our Government was conspiring with them? I think not.
It was Al qeadas desire to goad us into a war that would bankrupt us in the same way that WWI and WWII did to the Brits and much of Europe. Half a trillion and counting so far with years to go.
You seem to be happy to consign us to that fate with your ramblings about the fantasy justifictions for war with Iraq and the Fantasy Justifications for War with Iran, and probably a whole host of other countries.

Justtellthetruth:

Douglas Feith report by the Pentagon inspector general found that the activities by Mr. Feith’s Pentagon Policy office were all legal and the office’s officials did not mislead the Congress. The report followed years of exceptionally ad homonym attempts by the left to discredit Mr. Feith, accusing him, in effect, of an attempt to mis-lead the Congress into its war declaration. The new report from the inspector general finds that nothing Mr. Feith did broke the law.

The worst the report came up with is that some slides in a power PointPresentation presented to the White House were not properly vetted and cleared by the CIA. $50 says they were slides of relevant CIA or DOD info anyway.

This seemed too much for the
Washington establishment. The Washington Post issued a story attributing to the Pentagon inspector general’s report a raft of negative quotes about Mr. Feith, such as that Mr. Feith’s office produced “reporting of dubious quality or reliability” and that the office “was predisposed to finding a significant relationship between Iraq and al Qaeda.” The only hitch was that it turned out not to be true.

The quotes were not from the Pentagon inspector general but from a two-and-a-half-year-old report of Mr. Feith’s (and President Bush’s) most implacable political enemies, Senator Levin, the Michigan Democrat. The Post issued an elaborate, 248-word correction to the story.

The original Post article quoted the Pentagon inspector general as stating that Mr. Feith’s office drew on “both reliable and unreliable reporting” to produce a link between Al Qaeda and Iraq “that was much stronger than that assessed by the IC [ Intelligence Community] and more in accord with the policy views of senior officials in the Administration.” But that was also from Mr. Levin’s report.

The Post’s correction said that its original article “also stated that the intelligence provided by Feith’s office supported the political views of senior administration officials, a conclusion that the inspector general’s report did not draw.”
In other words, there seems to be something in the ether in Washington that just has a hard time giving Mr. Feith his due.

Even the inspector general’s report seems to find fault — though nothing remotely illegal — with the notion that Mr. Feith’s office took a skeptical view of the intelligence that was being circulated through the government in advance of the war. It suggested that the criticism Mr. Feith’s office made of the intelligence community’s product was itself an intelligence activity. It’s a ridiculous suggestion.

If we have learned nothing else from the history of the Iraq war it is that intelligence deserves to be criticized by policy officials, rather than blindly accepted.

Mr. Feith himself, in a statement on the latest developments, pointed out that the Commission on Weapons of Mass Destruction headed by Judge Silberman and Senator Robb specifically said that while “policymakers must be prepared to credit intelligence that doesn’t fit their preferences, no important intelligence assessment should be accepted without sharp questioning that forces the community to explain exactly how it came to that assessment and what alternatives might also be true.” Messrs. Silberman and Robb said that was “not ‘politicization’” “but ‘a necessary part of the intelligence process.”

Mr. Feith’s statement said: “If the Inspector General’s opinions about appropriate criticism were followed, they would discourage policy officials from asking tough questions about the quality of CIA work.”

Which is the real nub of the whole contretemps, which, after all, takes place after a season in which the Central Intelligence Agency, in one of the greatest scandals in American history, has been working to undercut the policy of an elected administration.

It’s a sweet coincidence — if it is a coincidence — that all this comes to a head as Vice President Cheney’s aide, I. Lewis Libby [another manufactured “controversy”], was on trial in a case that at bottom arises from an effort of the administration to expose the CIA’s shenanigans – and was a little over bearing in doing so..

My view is that, even if it takes time, the truth eventually will come out as the history of this period is written. Those who reacted to the frustrations of this war with personal attacks on the honest and hard-working figures who participated in the policy debates that led up to the congressional war vote will be exposed, and those, like Mr. Feith, who risked all to ask the tough questions will get their recognition when the history is written. Hopefully sooner.

Again, there is no disagreeing with the premise of this question:

DO YOU AGREE WITH FUNDING AL QAEDA AFFILIATES?

Doing so is treason. I am surprised Rolling Stone isn’t as rabid as Fox News is in hunting down traitors.

I asked you a simple yes or no question Gary. You apparently have trouble understanding the english language.

Again: Yes or no, do you believe the U.S. should fund Al Qaeda affiliated groups?

This question is not about understanding Sunnis and your attempt to expand the issue as such is a pathetic attempt to dodge the question.

Implicit in the question is the understanding that groups the U.S. funnels money to are in fact, funding Al Qaeda.

Again, do you believe the U.S. should fund Al Qaeda affiliated groups. Yes or no.

By the way, it’s starting to sound like you’re losing your backbone in the war on terror.

Word 1:

You can think you know what you are talking about all you want. Its still doesn’t change how stupid your question is. Especially from someone who thinks Pat Buchannon was President. WHAT A FRIGGIN JOKE YOU ARE.

We are going for the Napolean strategy of divide and conquer. If you can’t see that, then you have serious mental issues as I have explained it many times.

If you want to talk about “our friends” the Saudis funding unsavory Sunni groups, that’s another story. They are funding groups all over the wrold, including CAIR and a few other sinister islamic-fascist front groups right here in the USA.

This brings us back to my repeated underlining point of the fact that the sooner we get away from petrol-blackmale.

AS I HAVE SAID A THOUSAND TIME, OUR FOREIGN POLICY IS NOT BASED ON REALITY.

BTW… EVERYTIME anyone goes to a Shell gas station to fill up, you fund al Qaeda, as they do business in IRAN.

And btw… it is not avoiding the subject for me to explain to you how IRAN FUNDS AL QAEDA DIRECTLY. OR that there is a difference between Sunni groups.

THAT’S MORE LIKE YOU AVOIDING REALITY.

Gary,

regardless of how many times you repeat incorrect informantion and viewpoints, they remain incorrect.

The pentagon, CIA, FBI, and the vast majority of our government as well the governments of almost every nation on earth disagree with your version of the facts (that there was any pre war AL qaeda connection in Iraq) and in fact most sources seem to indicate that if you want to find bin laden and the other leadership, as well as the taliban and the leaders of a ring that ALREADY has sold nuclear technology to our enemies, you need to go to pakistan, not Iraq. But since pakistan already has nukes and no oil, they have remained low on our radar despite being extremely target rich.

God willing, we will pull out of Iraq soon, and focus on securing afgahnistan, putting extreme pressure on Pakistan to let us clear out Al qeada, the taliban, and the remaining AQ khan network, and importantly, work to remove every settlement and and the occupation from the West Bank and East Jerusalem, as the Iraq Study Group suggests, in order to effectively shut down a huge portion of the engine that has driven M.E. terrorist recruitment and funding for the last 4 decades.

Justtellthetruth:

Unfortuna tely rolling Stone is run by a bunch of lazy propagandists that erase posts without really reading them.

I have already CRUSHED your “arguments”. they erased them

It seems that the truth hurtsd for them.

I’ll get to you again later.

Gary,

Here is the report from the Pentagons Inspector General absolutely debunking any notion that there were credible ties between Saddam and Al qeada. Perhaps you have some reason to believe that the IG of the Pentagon is not aware of the facts that you claim to have at your disposal?

Maybe you should call Douglas Feith and commiserate with him. He is most likely the only other person on earth at this point who would buy your BS.

The article is below:

Pentagon report debunks prewar Iraq-Al Qaeda connection
Declassified document cites lack of ‘evidence of a long-term relationship,’ although No. 3 Defense staffer called contact ‘mature and symbiotic.’
By Jesse Nunes | csmonitor.com

A declassified report by the Pentagon’s acting Inspector General Thomas F. Gimble provides new insight into the circumstances behind former Pentagon official Douglas Feith’s pre-Iraq war assessment of an Iraq-Al Qaeda connection — an assessment that was contrary to US intelligence agency findings, and helped bolster the Bush administration’s case for the Iraq war.

The report, which was made public in summary form in February, was released in full on Thursday by Sen. Carl Levin, chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee. In a statement accompanying the 121-page report, Senator Levin said: “It is important for the public to see why the Pentagon’s Inspector General concluded that Secretary Feith’s office ‘developed, produced and then disseminated alternative intelligence assessments on the Iraq and al-Qaeda relationship,’ which included ‘conclusions that were inconsistent with the consensus of the Intelligence Community.’ ”

The Feith office alternative intelligence assessments concluded that Iraq and al Qaeda were cooperating and had a “mature, symbiotic” relationship, a view that was not supported by the available intelligence, and was contrary to the consensus view of the Intelligence Community. These alternative assessments were used by the Administration to support its public arguments in its case for war. As the DOD IG report confirms, the Intelligence Community never found an operational relationship between Iraq and al-Qaeda; the report specifically states that,” the CIA and DIA disavowed any ‘mature, symbiotic’ relationship between Iraq and al-Qaida.”

The Los Angeles Times reports that in excerpts of the report released in February, Mr. Gimble called Feith’s alternative intelligence “improper,” but that it wasn’t illegal or unauthorized because then-Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz assigned the work. The Times also reports that a prewar memo from Mr. Wolfowitz to Feith requesting that an Al Qaeda-Iraq connection be identified was among the newly released documents.

“We don’t seem to be making much progress pulling together intelligence on links between Iraq and Al Qaeda,” Wolfowitz wrote in the Jan. 22, 2002, memo to Douglas J. Feith, the department’s No. 3 official.

Using Pentagon jargon for the secretary of Defense, Donald H. Rumsfeld, he added: “We owe SecDef some analysis of this subject. Please give me a recommendation on how best to proceed. Appreciate the short turn-around.”

The Times reports that the memo “marked the beginnings of what would become a controversial yearlong Pentagon project” to convince White House officials of a link between Iraq and Al Qaeda, a connection “that was hotly disputed by U.S. intelligence agencies at the time and has been discredited in the years since.”

The New York Times reports that presentation slides used during a Pentagon briefing at the White House were also released Thursday. The slides showed how Feith criticised US intelligence agencies that had found little or no Al Qaeda-Iraq link.

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seriously…a post on funding a “questionable” group because they’re fighting a bigger enemy? Why not waste more time/resources eleswhere. folks seem to forget that the US has backed NUMEROUS questionable groups in the past, when those groups were fighting people that we liked even less. let me see…we funded the taliban when they were fighting the soviets, we funded iraq when they were fighting iran, we sold planes to iran when the shah was in power to stave off the soviets, we backed the ARVN because they were fighting the communists in vietnam, noriega in panama, perez in argentina…on and on…are you seriously dimwitted and ignorant enough to be “surprised” by the present move to back sunni fundamentalists? they are serving a presently critical tactical purpose and as long as they do so, they will be backed accordingly. if we didn’t need Musharraf in Pakistan, he’d be taken out. just as Hussein in Iraq was taken out after: 1. he no longer proved useful 2. attacked kuwait (which upset the Saudis)…so now we find ourselves in the not-so-enviable position of backing the lesser of two evils because we don’t want the shia (read:iran) to strengthen their influence in the mideast. please go back and take some poli sci and history classes, and if you have…pay attention this time.

one more thing…if you think that the strategic US agenda is planned by the aipac or some other jewish “conspiracy” you clearly are the most deluded on the post. look at this tactically (need a dictionary?): the saudis have the largest proven oil reserves worldwide, the saudis have a great amount of influence in the US (b/c of their oil), the saudi government is in our pocket and vice versa, we have a definitive tactical reason to keep the saudis happy (oil!), the saudis are sunni, the iranians are shia…they HATE each other and are taking great lengths to kill each other…see what i’m getting at? so, if you in your deluded tinfoil hat beliefs think for one second that any of this has to do with israel…it is you who are in the dark. so get a clue. and read something other than whatever claptrap it is that you subscribe to there mcveigh…

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